Sorry, but I still don't get why some of you were so excited about the first design. Especially since it is right next door to the Canopy.

That first design would not have filled out that corner the way the second, and certainly the current design does. It would have been out of place.

Those that like the first design, can you give SPECIFIC reasons other than it was unique, (how so?), or "ground breaking", (again, how so, seemed pretty ordinary to me)?

I'll agree, the river level looked very nice in the first renderings, but I have no reason to believe that will not be the case in the final form.

^^ For lack of a better descriptive, it looked like a giant picture frame encasing the building and attracting your eye. The material looked like it would have been top notch (at least in the renderings). It was unique in that no other building looks anything like it, but in a good way... not in a shiny glass "look at me" way. There's too much glass in cities already... San Antonio doesn't need a bunch of glass buildings for them to be noticed and respected. People put too much stock in glass. Glass doesn't necessarily make it good or modern. It was elegant and simple but certainly not plain. To make an analogy, to me it fit of the mold of, "Don't tell people you're smart, just be smart and they'll think it for themselves." People would have been taking pictures of it and posting them on Instagram (or wherever) much more than will happen with the approved version.

I agree. The only "unique" aspect of the first design was that it was a box with a slight turn, similar to the overpriced, underdesigned Convention center next to the Grand Hyatt downtown.

This new design is very pretty. And I think they changed it because of the changing architectural landscape and desire for more glass – something I believe the frost tower had much influence on. If the Hilton Canopy took place a 1 year later, I bet there would have been more glass, but at current, I am not unhappy with the design. It's one of my favorite projects right now.

The first design was just very beautiful and different to me. Would have been perfect just needed to be a little taller imo. The second one is great, however. I still really like this project and hopefully it’s a design catalyst for that area.

This current design is actually the third design.

@restless 1, nothing to really "get". We can all share what we think here. But remember, they are opinions. Not right, not wrong.p Personally I like taking them all in weather I agree or not.

Same here. I appreciate all opinions. I also appreciate all respect for each other.

^������

That was just a comment on how it's good when everybody shows each other respect. That's something that's good about this forum. Everybody here loves buildings and construction. That's our shared nerd superpower and it's a good one.

Sorry Jack, I meant to give a arrow with a thumbs up sign! Dont know why it put the question marks?!

:tup:

For me, I'm pretty easy to please. Yes, I think most of the new stuff popping up around SA probably wouldn't blow anybody from Austin, Houston, or Dallas away because they're used to seeing modern 40 floor construction on a regular basis. However, what we are getting is very much better than what was there before. At least we're not going backwards. We've seen nothing change in SA for so long, so to see what's happening the past couple of years has been refreshing. The Pearl went from an eyesore to an absolute gem in a relatively short amount of time...and it is still growing. I believe that the developments we're getting in the short term will set the precedent for future growth. When Frost is done, some developer will come along and desire to 1-up the Frost Tower. We are fortunate enough to have elected officials that really understand the need to keep SA competitive on the national level, especially with an estimated 1 million more residents expected by 2040.

I agree with a lot of what you have said. But, I have been casually browsing the Austin and Houston pages. And I would take the Frost Tower over anything new going up in either of those cities. If someone 1-ups the Frost Tower here in town than that would be a truly awesome building. Also, let's not forgot how great San Pedro Creek is and will be. With development on lower Broadway, River North, downtown, Southtown, and San Pedro Creek going on simultaneously San Antonio is taking a giant step forward.

I agree with you on your statements!

Two thoughts:

We are San Antonio, and not Dallas, Houston or especially Austin. You can clump these three cities together, but San Antonio is "different, historical, and unique" :cheers:


And who said bigger and taller is better?:cheers:

This 100%. It's absolutely my opinion on our current development in San Antonio. I love that we are finally getting more modern developments and I hope this sets a precedent for future growth. That said, I love the new design of the Floodgate and I'm really glad the developers didn't settle for a generic design after deciding to increase the height of this project.

Also agree! Theses developments IMO are currently the best things going not just in TX, but pretty much a anywhere!

All we have seen of both the first design and the second design are pretty renderings that (esp in the case if the second plan) hardly show what it will look like. It is all gauzy and watercolored. I’m sure after it gets value engineered to something that is actually buildable, you won’t like it as much.

I hope the project works, but obviously the first interation didn’t pencil out, so we’ll see.

I’m not sure I’m understanding. Are you saying we might not like the 17-story design?

0h, I'm pretty sure I'll like it!

I’m not saying you won’t like it. I’m just saying that conceptual renderings for HDRC are very early designs, intended to get prelim approval before a bunch more money is spent on additional architectural and engineering work.

As that process moves forward, change is inevitable, so just that there’s not a whole lot of point debating which of those two designs are better.

But, as I write this I realize how curmudgeonly I sound, and really it’s fun to talk about cool stuff in SA, so just ignore me and carry on.

Isn’t this technically the third design? There was the ten story design, 15 story design and now the 17 story design.

Actually there was an earlier 2 story design (just river level and street level) that was rejected by HDRC, so I guess four if you count that!

By the same developer?

I don't believe it was the same developer. If I remember correctly it was basically a couple unit condo with a restaurant. (EDIT: I'm thinking of the Lula's/Tano's property that became the now-cancelled Saint Hotel)

So, as you stated, 3 designs:
1st one by Overland (nice)
2nd one by ? (to me, it looked like an in-house quick-to-get-approval scheme)
3rd one by the current architect (very nice)

100% Design Drawings hit the streets last week and this project is going into budgetary round. Estimated construction start is being listed as Jan 2019.

Sweet! When do you think we'll be able to see those?

Where did the 210 foot height come from?

Here are the elevations for The Floodgate development.

198 ft to the roof and 215 ft to the mechanical roof/crown.

This area is going to be really something special in three years. Sad to see Bella on the River go, though. I hope the integrity of the area remains with new development.

Nice. Do you have the link to the original file? I'd like to update the building's database page with that info, including the highest floor height, etc.

You mean the integrity of the payday loan shops, the hordes lining up outside Whataburger, and people puking all over Commerce every night?

Yes, exactly.

WOW!!!
I had no idea Commerce Street was turning into a Sixth Street in Austin, with all the late night puking going on!!! LOL!!:haha:

Fryguy, Bella has not closed, it is simply relocating. That is all. Still excellent food from Bella to be had by all!!!:cheers:

I meant the area facing the River. Yes, the street side is gross. I just love the trees and the beautiful ambience of the restaurant. Best restaurant in SA

Girls, you're both pretty. Can we move on now?

The Historic Commission has given another approval for this project. Developer wants to start construction in October or November. Final approval will probably come by end of summer, which is nearby!
The article is on mysa.com
Can someone please post the article?

This one is getting built.:cheers:

The article you’re talking about is from early June.

Oh sorry, at least it is NOT fake news......:haha:

They have begin site work. You can see it on the Canopy Cam.

The scaffold on the building with the "pher" graffiti?

Ha! If you watch the timelapse, you can see that the graffiti appeared pretty recently.

Wheres the link to the cam?

I believe what you're seeing is renovation work on the Witte Building, not the Floodgate. The four rooftops that are now visible between the Canopy and Witte (the Esquire rooftop is covered by Canopy) is where the Floodgate will eventually go up.

Preliminary HDRC agenda for:
December 05, 2018

Address/Description: 139 E COMMERCE ST
141 E COMMERCE ST
106 RIVERWALK
143 E COMMERCE ST
145 E COMMERCE ST
147 E COMMERCE ST
149 E COMMERCE ST
151 E COMMERCE ST
Landmark Name:Commercial Building
RIO District:RIO-3
Applicant: Keller Henderson/Keller Henderson Interiors
Request: Demolition with new construction of seventeen story
residential tower
City Council Dist.: 1

From SA Heron-
https://saheron.com/renderings-show-...er-river-walk/

Henderson has not responded to interview requests from the Heron, but in 2017, he told the San Antonio Express-News that rents would be priced around $4 a square foot. That would make them the most expensive apartments in San Antonio.

Doing the math, that comes out to $2,988 a month for the smallest apartment (747 square feet) and $7,696 for the largest penthouse (1,924 square feet).

Floodgate Rendering
 

From The San Antonio Heron
Ben Olivo

[IMG]https://i.imgur.com/zELg5nF.jpg[/IMG]

Holy Shit... that's awesome....

I liked the original best, but this looks good too.

Just looking at the other renderings in that article, this really lost the river level synergy the first renderings showed. That's disappointing.

Wow!!!!! Home run after home run here is SA!