[Kanata] 2 The Parkway | 23m | 7 fl | Completed

[waterloowarrior]

http://app01.ottawa.ca/postingplans/appDetails.jsf?lang=en&appId=__8U46KB

An application to rezone lands from I1A - Minor Institutional to Residential High Density to permit a 16-storey high-rise building with residential underground parking and at-grade visitor parking.

Architect: Barry J. Hobin & Associates

[eternallyme]

I'd personally APPROVE the proposal. (At first, I would have put it ON HOLD but seeing the land makeup, approval is warranted).

While most of the area is R2-level (low density) residential, there is precedence for higher density areas directly on Teron. It would also give more impetus to put the Kanata North Transitway directly on that corridor. If it was on the other side of The Parkway, I would have rejected it for NIMBY concerns.

[citizen j]

Good.
Looks like an improved/redesigned version of Claridge's Lebreton Flats project.

[cityguy]

Any idea when this project will be moving forward?

[Proof Sheet]

Any idea when this project will be moving forward?

Not anytime soon if the local community association get their way

http://www.yourottawaregion.com/news/local/article/1253793--teron-bankrolls-highrise-battle

http://www.yourottawaregion.com/article/1253799--highrise-proposal-sparks-opposition-from-residents

[Ottawan]

:previous:

From the second of those two articles, I found this 'gem':

“All people can say is, ‘Oh my God’,” said Eileen Howell, who sits on the executive of the KBCA. “It’s Beaverbrook’s 9/11.”

This comment would be highly comical if it were not disturbing and offensive.

[Proof Sheet]

:previous:

From the second of those two articles, I found this 'gem':



This comment would be highly comical if it were not disturbing and offensive.

Not only does she sit on the Community Assoction board but she is also:

Howell, the director of heritage preservation for the Kanata Beaverbrook Community Association (KBCA).

I think I've heard everything now if there is a heritage preservation director for Beaverbrook.

[S-Man]

Maybe they can turn this monstrosity into a subdivision of normal 2-storey monster homes and build them in a forest or wetland somewhere. Problem solved, forever.
No wait! They don't like that!

I suppose, to follow their questionable line of metaphorical thinking, the Beaver Pond fiasco was Beaverbrook's Holocaust.

[S-Man]

Sorry, I'm just dumbfounded over this. There are some great 1980s-era houses pretty similar in Orleans and Kanata, too. They won't have to go far to find another 'unique' neighbourhood, and they wouldn't have search their memories for references to tall things that go boom in protest, either.

[S-Man]

Is this the heritage architecture not found anywhere else in the world?

http://g.co/maps/99n6h

[Proof Sheet]

Is this the heritage architecture not found anywhere else in the world?

http://g.co/maps/99n6h

http://maps.google.com/?ll=45.326082,-75.904562&spn=0.00003,0.027874&t=h&vpsrc=6&layer=c&cbll=45.326275,-75.904635&panoid=tE6w_HsSjv4vR8-F0kUxZg&cbp=12,283.46,,0,15.45&z=16

This is quite typical in Beaverbrook....the link you gave is also very common especially along Teron.

[gjhall]

"“It’s over half the height of the Statue of Liberty,” said John Donelly. (The Statue of Liberty is around 107 metres from the ground to the torch; the proposed 16-storey highrise is 49 metres)."

Fun with statistics! I'll add my own: it's 49,000 times as high as a sheet of paper is thick!

A 9/11 reference here is beyond the pale offensive. No words.

[waterloowarrior]

“The news of the rezoning application at the post office hit Beaverbrook like 9/11,” said Stirling. “It sent shivers of disgust through people in and beyond Beaverbrook.

“When everybody in the community learned about this, the typical response was ‘Oh my God.’”

The morning after a Beaverbrook travelling village dinner on Nov. 26, long-time resident John Sigler, who advised former Prime Minister Jean Chrétien on 9/11, knocked on Stirling and Howell’s door.

“John Sigler and his wife showed up on my doorstep with a bouquet of flowers and $1,000,” said Howell.

“It’s over half the height of the Statue of Liberty,” said John Donelly. (The Statue of Liberty is around 107 metres from the ground to the torch; the proposed 16-storey highrise is 49 metres).

“It’s Beaverbrook that is being attacked,” said Teron. “This is going to have to stop.”

“All people can say is, ‘Oh my God’,” said Eileen Howell, who sits on the executive of the KBCA. “It’s Beaverbrook’s 9/11.”


:stunned:

Statue of Liberty is 93m ground to torch btw http://www.nps.gov/stli/historyculture/statue-statistics.htm, I think it's a typo in the article

[Cre47]

“I'm well aware of what is good planning. This is the most outrageous contrast I’ve seen, ever,” said Teron.

Maybe Billy should realize, that his be-loved Kanata has seen some of the worst planning ever with its spaghetti-strings routes. Large communities like Bridlewood with one or two access to enter. The street grid of Beaverbrook and Kanata Lakes is atrocious.

[gjhall]

If the statement that there are only 5 communities in the world like Kanata, we can rest easy that most of the world has rejected the insanity of Kanata's planning.

[gjhall]

With all the 9/11 references, they should call this the Rudy Giuliani Tower.

[S-Man]

The word 'hysteria' comes to mind...

I think a really big Valium needs to be dropped in the Beaverbrook water supply before the freak-out gets worse.

I can see these people telling their grandkids:
"No, I wasn't in 9/11, but..."

[teej1984]

The comments to this community group's objections are amazing! Hats off to y;all! :cheers:

[Proof Sheet]

http://app01.ottawa.ca/postingplans/appDetails.jsf?lang=en&appId=__8U46KB

An application to rezone lands from I1A - Minor Institutional to Residential High Density to permit a 16-storey high-rise building with residential underground parking and at-grade visitor parking.

Architect: Barry J. Hobin & Associates

The application search function doesn't seem to be working..anybody else having this problem

[Uhuniau]

:previous:

From the second of those two articles, I found this 'gem':

This comment would be highly comical if it were not disturbing and offensive.

But apart from that it's hilarious, yes.

Yikes.

[Proof Sheet]

If the statement that there are only 5 communities in the world like Kanata, we can rest easy that most of the world has rejected the insanity of Kanata's planning.

You'll like this response.

http://postmediaottawacitizen.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/2-parkway-2011-11-25-not-compressed.pdf

[Harley613]

i'm having a little trouble understanding why a nice looking 16 story tower will look out of place right next to a fat old 11 story tower that nobody seems to mention. seems like a great spot to me...

[S-Man]

Apparently, ugly buildings built in the 1970s have become invisible with time, which is why they don't factor into an area's ugliness. Thus, newer, nicer buildings can be said to 'ruin' an untouched neighbourhood.

[gjhall]

You'll like this response.

http://postmediaottawacitizen.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/2-parkway-2011-11-25-not-compressed.pdf

Very funny. Towers in the park! Why didn't we think of that!

Groovy.

[S-Man]

I can tell from this presentation the president of the association (also a Friends of Lansdowne member) has only one way of presenting things to the community - in scary, overblown terms.

[citizen j]

A 9/11 reference here is beyond the pale offensive. No words.

I agree. Besides, a reference to Hitler would have been much more effective here.

[S-Man]

"We don't need a blitzkrieg of development in our community!"

[Uhuniau]

You'll like this response.

http://postmediaottawacitizen.files.wordpress.com/2011/12/2-parkway-2011-11-25-not-compressed.pdf

"endlessness".

Perfect!

[Uhuniau]

"We don't need a blitzkrieg of development in our community!"

"BARRY J HOBIN WANTS TO RUN OVER KANATA LIKE HITLER RAN OVER THE POLES!"

How's that?

[citizen j]

"BARRY J HOBIN WANTS TO RUN OVER KANATA LIKE HITLER RAN OVER THE POLES!"

How's that?

Quite.

[S-Man]

Endlessness?????

[gjhall]

Endlessness?????

Also, NATURALNESS.

Nothing is as natural as low density housing, remember everyone.

[S-Man]

My shadowy conspiracy theory for the day:

A commenter on David Reevely's Citizen blog notes Teron's involvement in this outcry and his closeness with the FOL crowd, and hypothesizes that he just might be the unnamed developer known to be financing the group.

[citizen j]

So what you're saying is that Teron is financing FOL so that he can torpedo Lansdowne Live, then approach the city with his own proposal once the ashes have settled? Interesting.

[eternallyme]

Beaverbrook is the LEAST dense part of Kanata (except for the rural part) and they sound like fanatics that hate transit and hate density period. Maybe they should move out to the rural areas?

How long after the area was developed did transit (in any form) come?

[waterloowarrior]

public meeting on Monday
http://www.yourottawaregion.com/news/local/article/1259016--public-meeting-for-beaverbrook-development

[eternallyme]

Looking at the local opposition, I would recommend that the project now be put ON HOLD. A clearer site plan, and perhaps a downsizing or relocation, should be considered. It may not be compatible with the community, and there are better places in Kanata (redevelop the original Town Centre, anyone?) that could use high-density development.

[S-Man]

Someone told me recently this community also protested the installation of SIDEWALKS once upon a time. Can't confirm, though.

[Uhuniau]

Also, NATURALNESS.

Nothing is as natural as low density housing, remember everyone.

Rabbit warrens, gopher holes, Kanata....

[eternallyme]

Someone told me recently this community also protested the installation of SIDEWALKS once upon a time. Can't confirm, though.

There was no transit initially when the area was built, correct?

[umbria27]

Someone told me recently this community also protested the installation of SIDEWALKS once upon a time. Can't confirm, though.

Someone told me recently this community also protested the installation of SIDEWALKS once upon a time. Can't confirm, though.

It wouldn't surprise me. The original plan for Kanata was to have pedestrian and automobile traffic be separated, hence the network of bike/walking paths that run through it. I can see some Teron-purists objecting to sidewalks as a dilution of the purity of the vision.

Beaverbrook was always a weird place. Teron likes to call it a Garden City, but Garden Cities are supposed to be self contained with their own jobs base. Kanata has always been at least in part, a bedroom community with the Queensway its lifeline to jobs.
What industry that is out there is very poorly located. Mitel, Digital, Newbridge etc. all went in as highway based industrial campuses to the north on March Road. The residential may be towers and cottages in a park, but the industrial is all bunkers in a cow field. This contributed to Kanata's sprawl. Those Electrical Engineers ended up buying townhouses in Katimivic then graduated to McMansions in Mortgage Grant.

Had Kanata council had had any guts it would have forced those high tech industries to build in the natural centre of the Kanata, near the Queensway and to build higher when they did so.

Teron seems upset that his grand plan is being tampered with, but the plan was blown in the 80s and 90s. It must be difficult for a man of his age to admit that his vision was flawed, so I'll cut him some slack. He was right about the Beaver Pond. Now is the time to put the brakes on suburban sprawl, but he's wrong about 2 Parkway. Now is also the time to increase density and along Kanata's incipient main streets.

[waterloowarrior]

Now proposed for 9fl / 30m

http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7077/6925853766_630fae6854_o.jpg

Revised plans available here http://app01.ottawa.ca/postingplans/appDetails.jsf?lang=en&appId=__8U46KB

[Proof Sheet]

http://www.yourottawaregion.com/news/local/article/1343614--developer-still-facing-opposition-to-kanata-apartment-plan

There are some gems in terms of quotes especially near the end. Apprently, Beaverbrook is an oasis from high density urban sprawl.

The quote from the consultant that this application maintains a general pattern of open space is sure to be greeted with some eye rolling by the Beaverbrook residents.

[waterloowarrior]

forget to post this a little while back

http://www.keeptotheplan.ca

there is a planning analysis by Barry Wellar (based on the old proposal)

http://www.beaverbrookcommunity.ca/wp-content/uploads/2011/12/KBCAOpinon2011Dec27.pdf

[gjhall]

From the article, Beaverbrook is an architectural gem? Disagree.

[S-Man]

Anything above 2 stories kills children. Why does the developer want to destroy a generation, especially one living in such a unique, heritage example of North American suburbia?

[kevinbottawa]

forget to post this a little while back

http://www.keeptotheplan.ca

The video on this website makes me sick. They even want to ban duplexes and triplexes?

[S-Man]

Yikes. Sorry, but the '60s are over, and so is the 'Kanata Dream'.

Maybe if some of these suburbanites gathered up some courage and ventured to the oldest streets of Lowertown (circa 1880-1890) they'd see duplexes and triplexes and four-plexes of two to three floors in height all co-existing, looking like the most natural, organic thing in the world.

To me, there is nothing beneficial or organic about cloned, cookie-cutter sameness. However, it seems like heaven to these quacks.

[gjhall]

Yikes. Sorry, but the '60s are over, and so is the 'Kanata Dream'.

Maybe if some of these suburbanites gathered up some courage and ventured to the oldest streets of Lowertown (circa 1880-1890) they'd see duplexes and triplexes and four-plexes of two to three floors in height all co-existing, looking like the most natural, organic thing in the world.

To me, there is nothing beneficial or organic about cloned, cookie-cutter sameness. However, it seems like heaven to these quacks.

Oh please don't send these clowns to my neighbourhood.

[waterloowarrior]

Beaverbrook residents looking to preserve neighbourhood’s original vision

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/homes/Beaverbrook+residents+looking+preserve+neighbourhood+original+vision/6900129/story.html

A recent proposal for a nine-storey condo at the entrance to Beaverbrook has some residents wondering how to preserve what is cherished about the community. They are considering requesting that Beaverbrook become a heritage conservation district under the Ontario Heritage Act.

[Cre47]

Beaverbrook residents looking to preserve neighbourhood’s original vision

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/homes/Beaverbrook+residents+looking+preserve+neighbourhood+original+vision/6900129/story.html

The original vision of a poorly-planned neighborhood with almost no commercial space and with its disastrous street layout with its spaghetti-string crescents. Geez.

[eternallyme]

I guess they hate density there? It is one of the lowest-density areas in the urban part of Ottawa (about 2 to 3 units/acre).

[c_speed3108]

The original vision of a poorly-planned neighborhood with almost no commercial space and with its disastrous street layout with its spaghetti-string crescents. Geez.

"A gas station was designed with the same architectural details as houses"

:eeekk:

:dead:

[Kitchissippi]

Ah the endangered bungalow hidden behind a two-car garage. Pity. Quick, someone fight for pre-automobile neighbourhoods like Centretown and the Glebe and call for banning of all driveways and garages to preserve their community's original character!

[J.OT13]

If you live in the city and flip out in the face of urban renewal, noise, construction and condo projects; you’re an idiot, it’s part of life in the city. But if you choose live on a quiet 60s suburban street, I think you have more of a right to oppose change.

[jaydog0212]

If you live in the city and flip out in the face of urban renewal, noise, construction and condo projects; you’re an idiot, it’s part of life in the city. But if you choose live on a quiet 60s suburban street, I think you have more of a right to oppose change.

The issue is some want to keep Beaverbrook as it is acting like its a great place the thing is if they don't want change does this mean people can't upgrade there homes etc if so i could see house values tanking in that area.

[J.OT13]

The issue is some want to keep Beaverbrook as it is acting like its a great place the thing is if they don't want change does this mean people can't upgrade there homes etc if so i could see house values tanking in that area.

It should mean keeping the original character of the house and neighbourhood, i.e. no stucco, fake brick/stone or other "modernization efforts", no tearing down two perfectly fine 60s bungalows for a stucco mansion.

[jaydog0212]

It should mean keeping the original character of the house and neighbourhood, i.e. no stucco, fake brick/stone or other "modernization efforts", no tearing down two perfectly fine 60s bungalows for a stucco mansion.

The issue is Beaverbrook is not a high end area if you tell people who may want to buy a house and make major changes sorry you can't do that or that people won't be interested in buying.

[J.OT13]

The issue is Beaverbrook is not a high end area if you tell people who may want to buy a house and make major changes sorry you can't do that or that people won't be interested in buying.

That’s the point; it's like adult communities or smoke/pet free condos, you're looking for a "desirable" target buyer. Make some sort of bylaw in a few specific neighbourhoods (agreed by majority of the community) that says you don't want to lose the character of the houses/neighbourhood and you then attract "desirable" buyers, not dickwads wanting to tear down nice houses for a stucco mansion.

[waterloowarrior]

Fund to fight spot-zoning collects $30,000
Posted Jul 12, 2012 By Blair Edwards
http://www.emckanata.ca/20120712/News/Fund+to+fight+spot-zoning+collects+$30,000


EMC news - A special fund created to fight unwanted development in Beaverbrook has collected $30,000 so far, said Gary Sealey, president of the Kanata Beaverbrook Community Association.

"We raised (the money) from individuals," he said. "Each (donation) has a name behind it."

Some of the money has already been used to hire two city planners: Barry Weller and Dennis Jacobs as well as a lawyer, Tony Fleming, who have provided legal and planning advice concerning the proposed condo at 2 The Parkway.

Last week, the city announced it was delaying the release of a report on the proposed development until Aug. 23.

Kanata North Coun. Marianne Wilkinson said the developer, the Morley Hoppner Group, requested more time to discuss some of the recommendations from staff contained in the report.

"I take it (the developer) doesn't like the recommendations," she said during a public meeting held at the Mlacak Centre on June 29. "I'm disappointed it's taking so long because it keeps the uncertainty out there."

The proposal, which originally called for construction of a 16-storey condominium, had been revised to allow for a seven-storey apartment complex topped by a one-storey amenity area, coupled with two-storey townhomes.

The Save the Beaverbrook Fund was created in December, 2011, collecting donations from individuals and families in Beaverbrook with matching funds provided by Kanata founder

Bill Teron, one of the people spearheading the community's opposition to spot-zoning proposals.

[S-Man]

After the countless meetings and revisions a year or so ago at Greenbank and Craig Henry to get a 6-storey "skyscraper" knocked down to a highly unwanted 5 storeys, the developer isn't going to get the public consent for 7 storeys, or 6, or 4, etc, etc.

First of all I don't know why anyone would want to live there; second of all, the residents of Beaverbrook won't have it. It's 2-storey 1970s-style "Garden City Specials" or nothing.

[Lakche]

Ugh the new render is kinda plain... the original render looked really nice!

So this one is opposed because it's "too high" but just down the road... like literally 1 block down the road, is a 10 storey apartment building. Was that too high? How did it get built...

[waterloowarrior]

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/News/Ottawa/Latest+proposal+Beaverbrook+condo+tower+town+houses+Tuesday/7255837/story.html

new version going to public

[S-Man]

It seems it is still too high. Not Garden City-ish enough.

[citizen j]

It seems expressly designed to kill children. And old people.

[amanfromnowhere]

no way! Bill Teron says it still reminds him an elephant, in his backyard

[J.OT13]

The streets are narrow and there is no area of interests anywhere around the place (i.e. not a walkable neighbourhood). Furthermore, the streets are way to narrow and the possibility for good, reliable transit service is non-existent.

Infill and density should be in the city or on rapid transit lines, not in a suburban neighbourhood.

[rocketphish]

from the Ottawa Citizen (http://www.ottawacitizen.com/News/Ottawa/Latest+proposal+Beaverbrook+condo+tower+town+houses+Tuesday/7255837/story.html)

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/News/Ottawa/7255838.bin?size=620x400s
http://www.ottawacitizen.com/News/Ottawa/7255839.bin?size=620x400s

[citizen j]

The streets are narrow and there is no area of interests anywhere around the place (i.e. not a walkable neighbourhood). Furthermore, the streets are way to narrow and the possibility for good, reliable transit service is non-existent.

Infill and density should be in the city or on rapid transit lines, not in a suburban neighbourhood.

Just checking to see if you really just said that the suburbs should be left as they are. Interesting position.

[J.OT13]

Just checking to see if you really just said that the suburbs should be left as they are. Interesting position.

To a point, yes.

This proposal here does not in any way encourage people to live a healthy, car free life. The nearest shopping plaza is around 3 kilometers away and no one will bus, or walk that distance in the suburbs.

They might take the bus to the city for work, as a lot of people who live in single family houses do (mostly park and ride), but they will always use a car outside rush hour.

It sort of defeats one of the main purposes of intensification, bring hundreds upon thousands of people at the doorstep of shops/services/entertainment where one can live car free by choice with no problem.

Now I do think there are circumstances where intensification in the suburbs could work. Examples include Hazeldean road, Robertson or near Kanata Centrum (the best spot in my opinion since it replicates a traditional downtown) where people are near transit and those all-important shops and services.

But of course that should not come at the expense of park and rides (at grade, below or above grade structures) because they are essential to encouraging the thousands of suburbanites living in single family homes to take the bus to the City, if only to avoid traffic.

[Ottawan]

To a point, yes.

This proposal here does not in any way encourage people to live a healthy, car free life. The nearest shopping plaza is around 3 kilometers away and no one will bus, or walk that distance in the suburbs.

They might take the bus to the city for work, as a lot of people who live in single family houses do (mostly park and ride), but they will always use a car outside rush hour.

It sort of defeats one of the main purposes of intensification, bring hundreds upon thousands of people at the doorstep of shops/services/entertainment where one can live car free by choice with no problem.

Now I do think there are circumstances where intensification in the suburbs could work. Examples include Hazeldean road, Robertson or near Kanata Centrum (the best spot in my opinion since it replicates a traditional downtown) where people are near transit and those all-important shops and services.

But of course that should not come at the expense of park and rides (at grade, below or above grade structures) because they are essential to encouraging the thousands of suburbanites living in single family homes to take the bus to the City, if only to avoid traffic.

I feel that intensification needs to occur throughout the city, including the suburbs. While I personally wouldn't want to live in Beaverbrook, clearly more people do than the current number of units there permits or else these developments would not be getting proposed as they would be uneconomical.

Yes, development here will still depend on cars and not have the same positive impact as a similar condo tower might on a traditional mainstreet inside the greenbelt that is well served by transit. However, this development still moves towards a better city when compared to that same number of units having to be built yet further away from the core on an even-quicker expanding fringe (which is the alternative to this sort of development).

As compared to new development on Kanata's fringe, these units are centrally located. Beaverbrook is a good area for intensification as it is one of the few parts of Kanata that is (for this style of suburb) close to employment (March Road), shopping (Centrum) and proposed transitway alignments.

In short, this is a highly suitable area for intensification. Other suburbs have the occasional tower without loosing their caché. Alta Vista and Manor Park, two reasonably elite neighbourhoods, come to mind as places that have not suffered from the elephants in their backyards. Beaverbrook will also be fine, aside from a mild case of hysteria.

[waterloowarrior]

appealed to the OMB

[waterloowarrior]

http://app05.ottawa.ca/sirepub/agdocs.aspx?doctype=agenda&itemid=115042

2.
ZONING - 2 THE PARKWAY

ACS2012-PAI-PGM-0158
KANATA NORTH (4)

That the Planning Committee recommend Council refuse an amendment to Zoning By‑law 2008‑250 to change the zoning of 2 The Parkway from Minor Institutional (IA1) to Residential Fifth Density Subzone Exception (R5 [XXX]).

[McC]

Reevely watched what happened on this (these?) proposal(s) at Planning Committee today, heard a gong, called the situation "wretched" and concluded:

Whether you think Kanata needs a 10-storey (or so) condo, as Morley Hoppner does, or absolutely does not need one, this is a silly way to do urban planning.

Nailed it.
http://blogs.ottawacitizen.com/2012/11/27/the-wretched-absurdity-of-2-the-parkway/

[Proof Sheet]

Reevely watched what happened on this (these?) proposal(s) at Planning Committee today, heard a gong, called the situation "wretched" and said:

Nailed it.
http://blogs.ottawacitizen.com/2012/11/27/the-wretched-absurdity-of-2-the-parkway/

I wasn't at the meeting but David Reevely nailed it perfectly...the quoted sections below encapsulate in a nutshell what it can often be like in dealing with the behometh known as the City of Ottawa...especially in relation to the guarantees reference.



. In theory, if the latest version of the plan is acceptable to everybody, the city could approve it and Morley Hoppner could build a seven-storey thing and drop its OMB appeal. In practice, everyone wants guarantees from everyone else and without actually providing any themselves.

The city wants a promise from Morley Hoppner that if the city approves the seven-storey version, it’ll drop the OMB appeal. Morley Hoppner won’t drop its OMB appeal until it has city council’s approval in hand, whereupon the city will have absolutely no leverage to apply. And nobody can control what any random person in the community might want to do, such as appealing anything the city might choose to approve, or not.

[waterloowarrior]

I would be pretty upset if I booked off work just to come to the meeting and have the developer ask to defer. I think it would be good if planning public meetings were held in the evening. It also may be good to restructure things to have borough councils like Toronto does, so that rezonings, traffic calming, sign by-law exemptions etc would be dealt with locally, while planning committee would deal with OPA's, policy changes, and city-wide issues.

[Proof Sheet]

I would be pretty upset if I booked off work just to come to the meeting and have the developer ask to defer. I think it would be good if planning public meetings were held in the evening. It also may be good to restructure things to have borough councils like Toronto does, so that rezonings, traffic calming, sign by-law exemptions etc would be dealt with locally, while planning committee would deal with OPA's, policy changes, and city-wide issues.

Totally agree....Committee of Adjustment is like that...if the applicant or committee defer they don't need to provide a revised notice of the new date.

Getting back to 2 Parkway if the developer had proposed 7 storeys at the start, they may have got a positive stack recommendation and a vote in favour with one dissenting..but the community is so ticked off at this lets make a deal planning that I would not be surprised if an appeal is filed. I also don't think that 7 storeys will be low enough and not respecting the garden city ideals that many in the community hang on to

[waterloowarrior]

amended plan recommended for approval at 23m / 7 fl / 95 units http://app05.ottawa.ca/sirepub/mtgviewer.aspx?meetid=2406&doctype=agenda&itemid=123769

original report was for refusal at 32m / 9-10 fl / 120 units
http://app05.ottawa.ca/sirepub/mtgviewer.aspx?meetid=2281&doctype=agenda&itemid=125005

[waterloowarrior]

approved at planning committee, now onto council

[Uhuniau]

The streets are narrow and there is no area of interests anywhere around the place (i.e. not a walkable neighbourhood). Furthermore, the streets are way to narrow and the possibility for good, reliable transit service is non-existent.

Infill and density should be in the city or on rapid transit lines, not in a suburban neighbourhood.

Why should suburban neighbourhoods be immune from infill and increasing densities? That's an artificial brake on natural economic evolution. It needs to be lifted.

[Cre47]

Here's the tenor of the spaghetti-string streets and crescents response
http://www.ottawasun.com/2013/01/14/father-of-kanata-opposes-condo-project

[Uhuniau]

Here's the tenor of the spaghetti-string streets and crescents response
http://www.ottawasun.com/2013/01/14/father-of-kanata-opposes-condo-project

And a great quote from one of the comments in the Reevely blog post:

I've lived in Kanata for 43 years and have always enjoyed the diversity and balance of housing, parks, and setbacks.

Ah, yes. The setbacks. People throng to Kanata to marvel at the fruqking SETBACKS.

[Dado]

Why should suburban neighbourhoods be immune from infill and increasing densities? That's an artificial brake on natural economic evolution. It needs to be lifted.

Fair enough, but of all the places in Kanata that a condo could be put, this location is pretty dumb. For one, it doesn't help bulk up the Kanata Town Centre's density, which is apparently required now to justify a light rail extension. These condo dwellers will likely need a car for just about everything (unless they work downtown in which case they would have bus service). If they work in the Kanata North or South business parks they'll probably just drive, as they'll have to do for everything else. Nor is this condo in or near the Kanata North business park, which could frankly do with some extra density.

It's as if Ottawa's developers can't bring themselves to put condos where they might make sense and instead prefer to put them in existing lower rise residential areas just to get a rise out of people. Parking lots though - especially large ones measured in acres - are apparently sacred territory that can't be developed into condos.

Just think about it for a moment: where have all the recent suburban condo projects been built/proposed? This one is on a former post office. The Centrepointe Drive condo is on a vacant woodlot (the last one in Centrepointe). The one further along Baseline is to replace an existing housing development. There are a couple more under construction on vacant land in Kanata (at least they're in the Town Centre boundaries) and some low-rise condo projects exist in Barrhaven, again on vacant land. There's a project on Merivale across from the Experimental Farm, and this is about the closest we get to a suburban condo project replacing a parking lot, but there really is nothing on any of the vast acreages of parking lot that we have, which we continue to build more of, as well. The purpose of intensification in practice seems to be to enable vast surface parking lots to continue to exist.

[rocketphish]

Fair enough, but of all the places in Kanata that a condo could be put, this location is pretty dumb. For one, it doesn't help bulk up the Kanata Town Centre's density, which is apparently required now to justify a light rail extension. These condo dwellers will likely need a car for just about everything (unless they work downtown in which case they would have bus service). If they work in the Kanata North or South business parks they'll probably just drive, as they'll have to do for everything else. Nor is this condo in or near the Kanata North business park, which could frankly do with some extra density.

It's as if Ottawa's developers can't bring themselves to put condos where they might make sense and instead prefer to put them in existing lower rise residential areas just to get a rise out of people. Parking lots though - especially large ones measured in acres - are apparently sacred territory that can't be developed into condos.

Just think about it for a moment: where have all the recent suburban condo projects been built/proposed? This one is on a former post office. The Centrepointe Drive condo is on a vacant woodlot (the last one in Centrepointe). The one further along Baseline is to replace an existing housing development. There are a couple more under construction on vacant land in Kanata (at least they're in the Town Centre boundaries) and some low-rise condo projects exist in Barrhaven, again on vacant land. There's a project on Merivale across from the Experimental Farm, and this is about the closest we get to a suburban condo project replacing a parking lot, but there really is nothing on any of the vast acreages of parking lot that we have, which we continue to build more of, as well. The purpose of intensification in practice seems to be to enable vast surface parking lots to continue to exist.

Well, the location might seem dumb to you, but if I remember correctly, it's up to a developer to choose a site and decide to build there, not up to local residents or even the City (though the latter can influence it through bylaws). So why did this developer choose to build here? My guess is that they think they can sell units and make a profit. Simple.

[Dado]

Well, the location might seem dumb to you, but if I remember correctly, it's up to a developer to choose a site and decide to build there, not up to local residents or even the City (though the latter can influence it through bylaws). So why did this developer choose to build here? My guess is that they think they can sell units and make a profit. Simple.

Or it could also be that lots such as the retired post office and various aging residential lots are the only lots that developers can buy for redevelopment, no matter how dumb the location actually is vis-à-vis the City's own claimed goals for intensification.

Parking lots are pretty much sterilized for redevelopment because the ownership is tied to the rest of the property and an odd confluence of factors (entrenched car culture, including zoning requirements for parking, value-based property taxes, remote/non-local land ownership) basically ensures it stays that way.

And even when a parking lot does get redeveloped, such as Fairlawn opposite Carlingwood, it seems that a retail box mentality dominates the thinking such that they get redeveloped without any residential component.

[waterloowarrior]

^ good observations... Urbandale owns a good chunk of the Kanata Town Centre designated lands... they seem to be doing their own thing and have gone at a pretty slow pace until recently. http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=170732&page=2
An American REIT owns the Kanata Centrum lands... the only thing they plan to redevelop the parking for is a couple more big box stores.

[Lakche]

This location probably won't help with light rail extensions, but as it sits now, it's directly next to the current 93 transit-way route (Teron Road), and maybe a 10 minute walk from Eagleson Station

So not everyone would need cars...

Also being that it's right next to a 10-storey apartment building at the corner of Campeau and Teron, and adjacent to the high school, it doesn't really creep up against anyone's house... doesn't seem half bad to me.

[Proof Sheet]

And a great quote from one of the comments in the Reevely blog post:

I've lived in Kanata for 43 years and have always enjoyed the diversity and balance of housing, parks, and setbacks.

Ah, yes. The setbacks. People throng to Kanata to marvel at the fruqking SETBACKS.

You'll be pleased to know that the setbacks will be preserved for a little bit longer.

http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/Kanata+community+association+appeals+Beaverbrook+condo+development/8002465/story.html

[citizen j]

What? It's going to the OMB? Totally didn't see that coming.

[J.OT13]

Maybe we should just send all applications to the OMB right off the bat to save time, trouble and arguments.

[waterloowarrior]

deal between community association and developer is close
http://bulldogottawa.com/deal-near-on-2-parkway-in-kanata/

The City of Ottawa, Kanata Beaverbrook community association and developer Morley Hoppner are finalizing an agreement on the proposed redevelopment of #2 Parkway.


The agreement will result in increased protection for forest and greenspace on Teron Road and tree screening of the 7-storey tower City Council approved at The Parkway and Teron Road, Kanata.

“This arrangement will increase the value of our investment and provide substantial benefits to local and community residents. We’re committed to this objective”, said Ken Hoppner of Morley-Hoppner.

“The developer’s desire to work with the community to ensure the best possible solution is also a positive consideration”, said Councilor Marianne Wilkinson. “I will be working extensively with property owners and residents to work out exact details.”

The KBCA has agreed to drop its appeal to the OMB based on the confirmation of the commitment of the developer and City to these arrangements.

“This is a first step to improve green space protection for the whole of Teron Road”, said Gary Sealey, President KBCA. “It will help foster Teron Road’s evolution as a true parkway, with respect guaranteed for its open spaces. Residents will get enhanced environmental security and the opportunity through site planning to make the #2 Parkway project as attractive as possible.”

Kanata Beaverbrook Community Association is one of Ottawa’s oldest citizen associations. It was founded with the assistance of Bill Teron, O.C., recent recipient of the prestigious Jane Jacobs Lifetime Achievement Award. Over a thousand person-nights of meetings contributed to KBCA consultation on the developer’s proposal.

[kevinbottawa]

Bringing condos to Beaverbrook

by Sheila Brady Oct 17, 2013 in Homes | 0 comments

Intensification has leapfrogged over the Greenbelt, landing with an elegant, silver splash on a green corner in Kanata’s original community of Beaverbrook.

Two The Parkway is a suburban edition of condo living that is substantially cheaper, promising larger living space than the urban variation that has seen glass and steel towers spring up on Bank and Rideau streets and forever change Richmond Road in Westboro.

“The prices are $80,000 to $90,000 to $100,00 less than buying the same amount of space in a downtown condo,” says Ken Hoppner, vice-president of Morley Hoppner and the spark plug behind a sophisticated brick and glass condo planned for the leafy corner of Teron Road and The Parkway in the heart of Beaverbrook.

Prices start at $289,000 for a 675-square-foot condo on the second floor, going up to $699,000 for a 1,633-square-foot penthouse. In between, there are eight different designs, besides unique layouts on the ground level and four spectacular penthouse designs.

There are plans for guest suites, a fitness room, outdoor terraces, underground parking and top security.

The $40-million building was designed by Barry Hobin and bears a decidedly modern edge, similar to the trio of award-winning condos the architect designed for the Morley Hoppner Group at Westboro Station in 2007.

This will be the first modern condo in Beaverbrook, sitting close to the taller Atrium condos built more than two decades ago and next to Earl of March Secondary School and the John Mlacak Community Centre. The library next door is being expanded and the shopping complex at Terry Fox Drive and the Queensway is a short walk to the west.

The slick sales centre, set up in a former Canada Post sorting office, officially opens Saturday, but there were already seven sales by early October, including two penthouses in the appealing seven-storey condo.

Theresa and Doug Norris were early buyers, reserving one of the penthouses. It’s a corner affair, with 1,663 square feet, two bedrooms, a den and a huge terrace that faces west, providing a view over the trees and the Beaverbrook community where they raised two daughters.

The couple, both well into their 60s, sat through the public sessions when neighbours blasted early plans for a 16-storey building and grumbled when Morley Hoppner trimmed the building back to seven floors.

“I wrote letters to the editor. I think it is a fantastic idea, but at one point I thought we were going to be stoned,” says Theresa, who has deep roots in the community designed by Bill Teron in the early ’60s. They downsized 11 years ago from their large home, moving a few kilometres west to Kanata’s Tweedsmuir on the Park and an attached bungalow in an adult-lifestyle community.

Now they’re ready to downsize again.

“How could I leave my five grandchildren, my children and 92-year-old-mother?” asks Theresa, who visits her mother every day in her nursing home on nearby Campeau Drive. Her girls are also close. One lives in Beaverbrook and the other in Morgan’s Grant to the west.

“In many ways we are urbanites because many amenities of urban living are in suburbia,” says Doug Norris, a leading expert on the census, retiring after almost three decades with Statistics Canada. From an office tucked into the basement of his townhome, he now works four days a week as a senior vice-president and chief demographer for Environics Analytics.

“We are not giving up that much and being close to family is really very important to us.

“The extra savings are extra neat and we are getting a parking spot in the price,” adds Norris, who jokes that negotiations for his new office space “are up for discussions” when moving day arrives in April 2016.

It’s also good, he says, that there are housing options for the older population in Beaverbrook and other suburban communities. “I want to live in an active community and not have to go off somewhere.”

Ken Hoppner expects almost two-thirds of the 91 condos at Two The Parkway will be bought by baby boomers living in Beaverbrook or within a two- to three-kilometre range.

“The same thing happened in Westboro,” he says. “People want to downsize, but they want to stay in their communities. They buy the building, but they also buy the community.”

The next key is to give them modern conveniences, he says, including a leading-edge kitchen. At Westboro, this meant adding granite. At Two The Parkway, it’s designing a large island with a waterfall feature or a granite edge that falls to the floor. Hoppner added hardwood and ceramic flooring, lots of windows for natural light, a fireplace and a barbecue.

Hoppner did his own amateur demographic study before buying the site from Canada Post for $900,000.

“Location is everything,” he says, adding there is a large group of boomers who want to downsize and community is key.

Theresa Norris calls it a commitment.

“We love our bungalow and will stay if this does not go ahead. There is nowhere else I want to live.”

Two The Parkway

What: Seven-storey condo with 91 units designed by Barry Hobin

Builder: Morley Hoppner

Prices: Starting at $289,000 for a 675-square-foot unit, going up to $699,000 for a penthouse with two bedrooms plus den. Parking and locker included. Condo fees are 42 cents a square foot.

Sales office: Parkway at Teron Road

Hours: Monday to Wednesday, noon to 7 p.m., weekends, noon to 5 p.m.

http://www.ottawacitizenstyle.com/category/homes/bringing-condos-to-beaverbrook/?pid=4285

http://www.ottawacitizenstyle.com/wp-content/gallery/two-the-parkway/28698729-8429_morh_kanata_c.jpg

http://www.ottawacitizenstyle.com/wp-content/gallery/two-the-parkway/28698733-8429_morh_kanata_c.jpg

http://www.ottawacitizenstyle.com/wp-content/gallery/two-the-parkway/28698739-8429_morh_kanata_c.jpg

[S-Man]

The couple, both well into their 60s, sat through the public sessions when neighbours blasted early plans for a 16-storey building and grumbled when Morley Hoppner trimmed the building back to seven floors.

“I wrote letters to the editor. I think it is a fantastic idea, but at one point I thought we were going to be stoned,” says Theresa, who has deep roots in the community designed by Bill Teron in the early ’60s.

Yikes! Hard to imagine such a scenario occuring! :rolleyes:

Given the square footage listed here, does the price bear out the claim that units are $80-100K less than comparative units in the city?

[McC]

It's a pretty sharp-looking mid-rise, especially for such an un-urban setting. The large ground floor terraces are particularly appealing. I'd like to see more of that at the rear of main-street type midrises, (e.g., on West-Welli-Richmond) to soften the interface with the neighbourhoods behind the condo building, and to enable the same kinds of "over-the-fence how do you dos" that the neighbours two doors down from the apartment building have. You can't do it just anywhere because of needs of the parking and commercial uses at grade on the street-front side, but if there's a large rise in the grade from front to back -- like along parts of the south side of that corridor -- it should be possible to have 2nd floor units with at-grade patios at the rear in some instances.

[rocketphish]

:previous: Nice. Kanata needs more of these.

[1overcosc]

Now that the Kanata North BRT is going ahead, this building will be well connected to the rapid transit network. It's only a 5-10 minute walk away from the future station at March & Corkstown.

[Cre47]

Disappointed though it will be just 7 floors considering there are taller ones in the vicinity and also not that very far from the triplets further west on Campeau and that god awful building by Castlefrank and the 417 (and its eventual twins as well)

[Radar]

2 The Parkway is one of the best things that has happened in old Kanata. Finally, people will have a choice to remain in their community if they're thinking of downsizing and not have to worry about moving downtown or to the cold cement buildings that have become the Kanata Town Centre. :cheers:

[waterloowarrior]

http://www.twotheparkway.com/

Construction starts this summer according to http://ottawacitizen.com/life/homes/looking-ahead-to-the-2015-new-home-market-in-ottawa

[canabiz]

http://www.obj.ca/Real-Estate/Construction/2015-05-27/article-4161322/Work-officially-begins-on-Kanata-condo-project/1