Wellington Street (downtown) at risk of being renamed

[immanuel_smcs]

In recent weeks, Ottawa residents had to deal with the renaming of Robertson Road.
For anyone who shares the concern that local history and heritage are being rolled over, you should also be concerned that there is another street renaming in the process.

This is hundred times bigger than Robertson Road.
This is about the oldest street in the city, Wellington Street, named by the city founder, Lt-Col John By himself to honor the Duke of Wellington who funded the building of the Rideau Canal with over £800,000 pounds between 1826-1832.

In case you missed it on the Ottawa Sun website, here is the story :
http://www.ottawasun.com/2011/05/24/another-naming-project-for-city

The Rideau Canal is a recognized UNESCO World Heritage Site and 2012 will mark the 180th anniversary of its opening.
The canal is the centrepoint of the city. To the west is Wellington Street with the Parliament Buildings, the Supreme Court of Canada, the Library and Archives Canada, the Justice Department, the Bank of Canada and the Prime Minister's Office.
The west side of the canal was referred to as Uppertown or Upper Bytown.

On the east side, there is Rideau Street and closeby the By Market. This was Lowertown or Lower Bytown.

Renaming Wellington Street for the sake of renaming makes no sense.

Proposing to rename Wellington Street to Sir John A. Macdonald Boulevard may seem like a noble cause. It is nothing less than a bear trap.
There is already a MacDonald Street (notwithstanding the spelling mistake - no capital D) which is parallel to Cartier Street. These street have been around since the 1880s and are known by the local population.

As an organization that bares the names of the two most important Father of Confederation, Sir John A. Macdonald and Sir George-Étienne Cartier, we are not opposed to celebrating their achievements and commemorating their memories.

Quite the opposite. Since the early days of our campaign, we have proposed an alternative common-sense solution. A solution that would commemorate these great men equally which respecting local history and without disrespecting heritage.

What we have proposed is to rename Airport Parkway to Macdonald-Cartier Airport Parkway. It makes sense. The city's airport is named after Macdonald-Cartier. The current road name is administrative bland.

There is also historic precedent. The last time this issue was considered at city hall in 2003, the National Capital Commission had a "formal objection" to the matter. This time it's much less clear.

The mayor of Ottawa, Jim Watson does not support the renaming, yet the Planning Committee is going ahead and is expected to receive a report in September.

If this issue interests you, please visit www.savewellingtonst.ca

Thank you,

Immanuel Giulea
Chair of the Save Wellington Street campaign
Founder and Executive Director, Société Macdonald-Cartier Society

[ThePlanner]

If it's renamed McDonald Boulevard, they should move all the pubs to that street. Sir John A would approve.

[immanuel_smcs]

If it's renamed McDonald Boulevard, they should move all the pubs to that street. Sir John A would approve.

The name of our first post-Confederation Prime Minister spells Macdonald (not Mc and no capital D).
And let's hope the renaming never happens.

Wellington Street is too important to be renamed.

The pubs are on the pedestrian Sparks Street, government is on Wellington Street. It's fine the way it is now.

Immanuel

p.s. McDonald (your spelling) is a fast-food chain.

[ThePlanner]

Keep in mind you're conversing with a planner. So don't tell me what is and isn't fine the way it is now. I intentionally misspelled our first prime minister's last name because I have nothing but contempt for him. The man was a drunken, corrupt racist. Read the hansards and prove me wrong!

[ThePlanner]

Keep in mind you're conversing with a planner. So don't tell me what is and isn't fine the way it is now. I intentionally misspelled our first prime minister's last name because I have nothing but contempt for him. The man was a drunken, corrupt racist. Read the hansards and prove me wrong!

By the way, I don't care whether the street is named for MacDonald or Wellington. Both are old dead colonizing elites who should be thrown into the dustbins of history.

[immanuel_smcs]

Keep in mind you're conversing with a planner. So don't tell me what is and isn't fine the way it is now. I intentionally misspelled our first prime minister's last name because I have nothing but contempt for him. The man was a drunken, corrupt racist. Read the hansards and prove me wrong!

You probably had a lousy history teacher in high school, so you can't be blamed for your misinformed views of our greatest prime minister and his many achievements.

Buildings on both sides of Wellington date back from the 19th century and owned by the federal government. Any unused land is also owned by the federal government.
In short, there exist no spaces for private development.

But we're going off-topic, so I'll stop here.


Anyone else want to comment about the historical and heritage value of Wellington Street ?

[Dado]

Keep in mind you're conversing with a planner. So don't tell me what is and isn't fine the way it is now. I intentionally misspelled our first prime minister's last name because I have nothing but contempt for him. The man was a drunken, corrupt racist. Read the hansards and prove me wrong!

By the way, I don't care whether the street is named for MacDonald or Wellington. Both are old dead colonizing elites who should be thrown into the dustbins of history.

What a sorry diatribe.

[bikegypsy]

I'm aware that all things do change but then again some should be left as they are... this is such a case. It would be like renaming The Rideau Canal, the Mississippi River, Mount-Royal mountain or Time Square. Just don't touch it. No offense to Sir A. Macdonald.

[immanuel_smcs]

I'm aware that all things do change but then again some should be left as they are... this is such a case. It would be like renaming The Rideau Canal, the Mississippi River, Mount-Royal mountain or Time Square. Just don't touch it. No offense to Sir A. Macdonald.

That's a beautiful way to put it out.
Wellington Street has been around for 185 years, since 1826.
Why change it now ?
There's already a MacDonald Street, named after Sir John A.
The Commemorative Naming Policy is clear about one commemorative per individual.

Immanuel

p.s. you didn't offend Sir John A.

[adam-machiavelli]

Well isn't this a fascinating conversation? I did a bit of research and discovered that the MacDonald-Cartier Society is very closely aligned with the Conservative Party of Canada -a little too close in my opinion. Given my past comments about conservative ideology, you can assume that anything an M-C society member says should be taken with a grain of salt.

[immanuel_smcs]

Well isn't this a fascinating conversation? I did a bit of research and discovered that the MacDonald-Cartier Society is very closely aligned with the Conservative Party of Canada -a little too close in my opinion. Given my past comments about conservative ideology, you can assume that anything an M-C society member says should be taken with a grain of salt.

This kind of affirmation is unacceptable!
And completely off-topic

The Macdonald-Cartier Society is a registered federal non-profit that independent and non-partisan. We have no political affiliation or alignment.
Stating otherwise is defamation and unacceptable.

I ask you to retract your statement.

How about you look at our website : www.macdonaldcartier.org

[Acajack]

I do find that there are many "missing" street names in Ottawa, when you consider that it is the capital after all. Sir John A. Macdonald is notably missing some type of prominent recognition. Some other prime ministers are relatively absent as well. As are the names of many provinces and cities also.

That said, I am not sure that renaming stuff that is already named after someone significant like Wellington is the best approach. As others have said, banal names like the Airport Parkway might be a good idea. The Ottawa River Parkway, often called the Western Parkway, could also be a prime target for a nice renaming.

[Dado]

Well isn't this a fascinating conversation? I did a bit of research and discovered that the MacDonald-Cartier Society is very closely aligned with the Conservative Party of Canada -a little too close in my opinion. Given my past comments about conservative ideology, you can assume that anything an M-C society member says should be taken with a grain of salt.

Good grief Adam. The guy who is proposing a change of the street from Wellington to something Macdonaldesque, Bob Plamondon, is himself associated with the CPC. So at "worst" you've got various CPC-sympathetic individuals arguing with each other, which is frankly something I could do with seeing more of. And here, we've got an organization with Macdonald in its own name arguing against renaming a street to something Macdonaldesque.

There's a point at which you've got to give up on looking for a partisan angle on things. This is one of them.


Anyway, as I have suggested elsewhere, we can rename the Ottawa River Parkway from the Wellington-Portage intersection at the Garden of the Provinces westwards to at least the aqueduct as Sir John A. Macdonald Boulevard. The Airport Parkway could also be renamed, perhaps to the Macdonald-Cartier Parkway.

[immanuel_smcs]

I do find that there are many "missing" street names in Ottawa, when you consider that it is the capital after all. Sir John A. Macdonald is notably missing some type of prominent recognition. Some other prime ministers are relatively absent as well. As are the names of many provinces and cities also.

That said, I am not sure that renaming stuff that is already named after someone significant like Wellington is the best approach. As others have said, banal names like the Airport Parkway might be a good idea. The Ottawa River Parkway, often called the Western Parkway, could also be a prime target for a nice renaming.

I agree that there might be streets "missing" but renaming historical streets in the downtown core is not the solution.

As founder of the Macdonald-Cartier Society, it would make no sense for me to argue against more commemorations for Macdonald or Cartier, the two most prominent and known Fathers of Confederation.
That said, there 36 of them, and elevating one above all others shows disrespect. Wellington Street is already part of the NCC ceremonial road Confederation Boulevard.

As for not enough recognitions of Macdonald, let's examine what Ottawa already has :
- statue of Sir John A. Macdonald on Parliament Hill
- MacDonald Street (misspelled) in Somerset ward, named after him since 1880s.
- Macdonald-Cartier Bridge linking Gatineau,QC to Ottawa
- Macdonald-Cartier International Airport

Elsewhere in Ontario:
- Macdonald-Cartier Highway
- statue at Queen's Park in Toronto
- boulevard in Kingston
- Historic site at his grave in Kingston
- Bellevue House in Kingston
- schools named after him in several cities

Despite all these recognitions, people still manage to misspell his name McDonald or Mcdonald or MacDonald.

So, in conclusion, the common-sense approach is to commemorate someone without wrecking the memory of someone else.
There is the "Airport Parkway" that leads to the Macdonald-Cartier Airport.
So why not rename it Macdonald-Cartier Airport Parkway or Macdonald-Cartier Parkway.

Immanuel

p.s. Did you know that apart from Ottawa, the only other Canadian city that has statues of both Macdonald and Cartier is Montreal,QC ?

[immanuel_smcs]

Good grief Adam. The guy who is proposing a change of the street from Wellington to something Macdonaldesque, Bob Plamondon, is himself associated with the CPC. So at "worst" you've got various CPC-sympathetic individuals arguing with each other, which is frankly something I could do with seeing more of. And here, we've got an organization with Macdonald in its own name arguing against renaming a street to something Macdonaldesque.

There's a point at which you've got to give up on looking for a partisan angle on things. This is one of them.


Anyway, as I have suggested elsewhere, we can rename the Ottawa River Parkway from the Wellington-Portage intersection at the Garden of the Provinces westwards to at least the aqueduct as Sir John A. Macdonald Boulevard. The Airport Parkway could also be renamed, perhaps to the Macdonald-Cartier Parkway.

Thank you Dado!

Mr. Bob Plamondon is a former policy consultant of Larry O'Brien and friends with Peter Hume.
That's how this renaming ended up at Planning committee instead of following the proper process. That's something everyone should be concerned about. Why is the author of books about the Conservative Party misrepresenting himself as an historian when his background is from Marketing and not history.


Anyways, I agree with the renaming of Airport Parkway, we have proposed that since July 2010.
Macdonald-Cartier Airport Parkway or Macdonald-Cartier Parkway

Having a "Sir John A. Macdonald Boulevard" would create confusion with the current MacDonald Street in Somerset, a concern for the Emergency Services. And it's also in direct violation of the city's Commemorative Naming Policy.

[Kitchissippi]

Personally, I am not against renaming Wellington in the future if it were for a name more inclusive and evocative of Canada or because of some truly nation-altering event or development (like Quebec finally signing on to the constitution :) ). After all, Ottawa would have remained Bytown if people did not endeavour to change its name during the incorporation of the city, or we would still be flying the Red Ensign if nobody championed the Maple Leaf. But Sir John A. Macdonald? Meh, it's too Ontario-centric.

Sure, the Duke of Wellington bankrolled the Rideau Canal, and Colonel By named the street after his financier. It was the colonial version of sponsorship recognition, I would imagine the Duke got some sort of return from it even though he never set foot on Canada. I'll be as upset about the renaming as when someone else buys the naming rights to Scotiabank Place.

[immanuel_smcs]

Personally, I am not against renaming Wellington in the future if it were for a name more inclusive and evocative of Canada or because of some truly nation-altering event or development (like Quebec finally signing on to the constitution :) ). After all, Ottawa would have remained Bytown if people did not endeavour to change its name during the incorporation of the city, or we would still be flying the Red Ensign if nobody championed the Maple Leaf. But Sir John A. Macdonald? Meh, it's too Ontario-centric.

Sure, the Duke of Wellington bankrolled the Rideau Canal, and Colonel By named the street after his financier. It was the colonial version of sponsorship recognition, I would imagine the Duke got some sort of return from it even though he never set foot on Canada. I'll be as upset about the renaming as when someone else buys the naming rights to Scotiabank Place.

The Rideau Canal was not a private endeavor. There was no private interest or wealthy business family that acted as "the financier" of the project.

The canal was financed by the British government from taxes of the British people. Over 800,000 pounds (or shillings).

So the "return" theory is invalid. This was not about sponsorship.

Rideau Canal represented the centrepoint of Bytown (now Ottawa).
To the west, Wellington Street and Upper Town.
To the east, Rideau Street and Lower Town.

There are socio-economic realms related to Upper vs Lower Town.
The name of Wellington Street is deeply linked to 185 years of local history of Bytown/Ottawa but also Upper Canada/Ontario.

For example, the son of Robert Baldwin, W.W.Baldwin was the chairman of a group who in 1829 wrote to the Duke of Wellington requesting responsible government.

Even before that, the Duke was deeply interested in the affairs of the Canadas.
Why else would he commission a report about the defenses in British North America.
This is known as the Smythe Commission of 1825

And even before that, in November 1814, the Duke was willing to travel to Canada to assist with the war between Britain and US. As you may know, this never happened because Napoleon escaped from Elba and Wellington fought and defeated Napoleon at Waterloo.

All this great history is worth remembering.
The streets downtown Ottawa all have historical names and they were given for a reason.

For example, Sparks Street is named after Nicolas Sparks, a pioneer of Bytown.
No one would dare suggest renaming Sparks!

[adam-machiavelli]

Wow this is the first time I've been accused of defamation for connecting an organization with the Conservative Party.

Also, ThePlanner, I think you're a troll. Your comments are too ridiculous to be taken seriously.

[immanuel_smcs]

Wow this is the first time I've been accused of defamation for connecting an organization with the Conservative Party.

Also, ThePlanner, I think you're a troll. Your comments are too ridiculous to be taken seriously.

Your affirmation was a serious accusation and completely unacceptable.

The Macdonald-Cartier Society is a non-partisan non-profit organization.
This is not open to debate. Our status is independent and non-partisan.

I strongly encourage and hope you will retract your accusation.

Immanuel

[OttawaSteve]

Well isn't this a fascinating conversation? I did a bit of research and discovered that the MacDonald-Cartier Society is very closely aligned with the Conservative Party of Canada -a little too close in my opinion.

Your affirmation was a serious accusation and completely unacceptable.

The Macdonald-Cartier Society is a non-partisan non-profit organization.
This is not open to debate. Our status is independent and non-partisan.

I strongly encourage and hope you will retract your accusation.

Immanuel

OK, now I'm curious. Perhaps Adam-Machiavelli can provide citations for the research that he did so the rest of us can assess it for ourselves.

[OttawaSteve]

All this great history is worth remembering.
The streets downtown Ottawa all have historical names and they were given for a reason.



To be clear, though, not every street in downtown Ottawa has retained its original name. Streets do get renamed.

http://chat.carleton.ca/~sjrifkin/ottawa1877.jpg

[gjhall]

True, but for the most part, and as it should be, streets that are renamed are those that are not ceremonially named: Centre St, streets named after types of trees, names of the children of developers, etc. Much the same as the suburban developments of today, developers of yesteryear (streetcar or earlier) named their streets for marketing purposes or after their family members. They are great candidates for renaming, but those named after historical figures shouldn't really be changed unless a major historical revision takes place.

[immanuel_smcs]

To be clear, though, not every street in downtown Ottawa has retained its original name. Streets do get renamed.



To be clear,
I didn't claim that every street downtown Ottawa had retained its original name.

For example, Laurier Street was not on your 1877 map.
This self-evident. Laurier became prime minister in 1896 and was in his glory in the early 1900s.

Short lesson of history

These streets are related in some way to Wellington:

- Coburg/Gloucester Sts. - fought against Napoleon on the Prussian side
- Cathcart St. - Cathcart - served under Wellington in Peninsula and at Waterloo; GG of BNA 1846-47
- Dalhousie St. - Dalhousie, George Ramsay, 9th Earl - CO 7th Division in Peninsular War under Wellington; send by W. to get Rideau Canal under way; to Ottawa in 1826 with Colonel By
Murray St. - Murray, George - fought in Peninsular War under Wellington; Quartermaster General; December 1814 to May 1815 provisional Lieutenant-Governor of Upper Canada and reviewed the defences of Canada; Lt. General of the Ordinance; Colonial Secretary

And these are related to Royals of the Time:

- Kent Street - Prince Edward, Duke of Kent and Strathearn - fourth son of King George III and the father of Queen Victoria
- Cumberland St. - Fifth son of King George III, the Duke of Cumberland
- Sussex Drive - Earl of Sussex; sixth son of George III; Grand Master of the United Grand Lodge of England, 1813-1843 (they were all Masons!)
- York St. - Frederick, Duke of York - second son of King George III; reformer of the British Army; Wellington succeeded him as commander-in-chief of the army
- Charlotte St. - Queen Charlotte, Princess of Mecklenburg-Strelitz

These are streets in the downtown core and were named for historical reasons.


So back to Laurier Avenue: It had a different name before it was Laurier, and it's fine that it was renamed. Laurier was a great prime minister and he needs to be remembered. Macdonald was also a great prime minister and he is commemorated through a statue on Parliament Hill. There is also a bridge, airport and highway on which he shares the name with Cartier.

Additionally, Macdonald and Cartier already have their own streets in Somerset Ward.
Drive west on Somerset Street towards QE Drive and you will find them ;)

[immanuel_smcs]

True, but for the most part, and as it should be, streets that are renamed are those that are not ceremonially named: Centre St, streets named after types of trees, names of the children of developers, etc. Much the same as the suburban developments of today, developers of yesteryear (streetcar or earlier) named their streets for marketing purposes or after their family members. They are great candidates for renaming, but those named after historical figures shouldn't really be changed unless a major historical revision takes place.

Very good points gjhall.
Additionally, when the city council considered the proposition for the Commemorative Naming Policy, the motion that adopted the report was amended to include that historical precedence should be given to streets.
This is not reflected in the policy posted on the city website but you can find this in the city council minutes of the July 24, 2002 meeting.

[adam-machiavelli]

A search for MacDonald-Cartier Society and Immanuel Giulea on Google reveals that the organization, of which Immanuel founded and seems to single-handedly run and promote has hosted multiple conservative thinkers but no progressive thinkers, the staff of the organization all have Conservative Party connections, and Immanuel (a self described "Christian Conservative") himself tried unsuccessfully to launch a national youth wing of the Conservative Party. I find it very odd that someone such as Mr. Giulea who likely holds the CPC in such high esteem would accuse me of defamation for simply connecting the dots. I also noticed that Immanuel and I have 2 common friends on Facebook :p

[immanuel_smcs]

Rideau Canal represented the centrepoint of Bytown (now Ottawa).
To the west, Wellington Street and Upper Town.
To the east, Rideau Street and Lower Town.

There are socio-economic realms related to Upper vs Lower Town.
The name of Wellington Street is deeply linked to 185 years of local history of Bytown/Ottawa but also Upper Canada/Ontario.



Just to complete what I mentioned earlier about the socio-economic realms separated by the canal in the early days of Bytown :



Growing Pains

At the Earl of Dalhousie's request, Colonel By laid out the town's grid. The Rideau Canal bisected the community, which was served by two main roads: Rideau Street in Lower Town and Wellington Street in Upper Town. Lower Town, to the east of the canal, was populated by Roman Catholics, both Irish and French; Upper Town, to the west, was made up largely of Protestants, both English and Scottish. Barrack's Hill (now Parliament Hill) was home to soldiers. Along the canal embankment, By allowed canal labourers to "squat" in sod or log shanties. This area became known as Corkstown, after County Cork in Ireland where many of the labourers were from. Once the canal was finished, the Corkstown inhabitants left Bytown or moved into Lower Town.
source: http://www.collectionscanada.gc.ca/databases/canadiandirectories/001075-2100-e.html

emphasis in red is mine.

[immanuel_smcs]

A search for MacDonald-Cartier Society and Immanuel Giulea on Google reveals that the organization, of which Immanuel founded and seems to single-handedly run and promote has hosted multiple conservative thinkers but no progressive thinkers, the staff of the organization all have Conservative Party connections, and Immanuel (a self described "Christian Conservative") himself tried unsuccessfully to launch a national youth wing of the Conservative Party. I find it very odd that someone such as Mr. Giulea who likely holds the CPC in such high esteem would accuse me of defamation for simply connecting the dots. I also noticed that Immanuel and I have 2 common friends on Facebook :p

Great! more defamatory accusations.

1- You continue to misspell the name of the organization, there is no capital D in Macdonald-Cartier. I already brought this to your attention.

2- The organization hosted a broad range of thinkers including Satya Das who is author of Green Oil and spoke in Montreal,QC for our first event in November 2009. We also had events in Ottawa, Toronto and Calgary,AB.

3- The so-called "Christian Conservative" you refer to has his own blog, and I never event met that guy!
http://canadaconservative.blogspot.com/
I am clueless on how you could even make another such defamatory accusation.
Please stop!

All this is off-topic.
But since I observe that you take great interest in my personal life:
And I want to add that whatever personal political conviction I may have, I have the right to have these and the Charter protects freedom of association.

That said, the organization is not run for personal interests or personal gains and therefore the organization is not connected to any political party. Our events were attended by people who may be involved in political parties or those youth who are not involved in partisan politics.

As for progressive thinkers, we had Janet Keeping from the Chumir Ethics Foundation in Calgary. So we had progressive thinkers. And Satya Das is another progressive thinker I already mentioned.

I hope this clears up any doubts on the organization's independence and non-partisanship.
And let's go back on-topic, please!

[Umpaidh]

While it's always important to know (http://ca.linkedin.com/in/immanuelgiulea) where your information (http://immanuel-a.blogspot.com/) is coming from (http://rabble.ca/blogs/bloggers/apicazo/2010/03/thinking-big-small-minds), I don't know how this applies to the subject at hand.

My personal opinion on the subject is that if we renamed Wellington Street, we would be losing a connection to the person who started the process for this very city to exist, way back before Canada was even a federal dominion.

Renaming either the River Parkway, or the Airport Parkway would be the best options.

[Dado]

Oh for the love of God...

Great! more defamatory accusations.

1- You continue to misspell the name of the organization, there is no capital D in Macdonald-Cartier. I already brought this to your attention.

Good point. Adam, stop misspelling our first Prime Minister's name (and I was recently guilty of this too...).


2- The organization hosted a broad range of thinkers including Satya Das who is author of Green Oil and spoke in Montreal,QC for our first event in November 2009. We also had events in Ottawa, Toronto and Calgary,AB.

3- The so-called "Christian Conservative" you refer to has his own blog, and I never event met that guy!
http://canadaconservative.blogspot.com/

Adam did not accuse you of being the author of the Christian Conservative blog, he simply accused you of being a Christian Conservative. But now that you linked to that blog, I decided to do some more research... it turns out that the author of that blog has had some unkind things to say about your attempts to form a youth wing in the Conservative Party:

http://canadaconservative.blogspot.com/search?q=immanuel

And the same named Satya Das that you mentioned above is mentioned in the letter you sent around that was republished on the above blog. At least the circles are all making sense.

A search for MacDonald-Cartier Society and Immanuel Giulea on Google reveals that the organization, of which Immanuel founded and seems to single-handedly run and promote has hosted multiple conservative thinkers but no progressive thinkers, the staff of the organization all have Conservative Party connections, and Immanuel (a self described "Christian Conservative") himself tried unsuccessfully to launch a national youth wing of the Conservative Party. I find it very odd that someone such as Mr. Giulea who likely holds the CPC in such high esteem would accuse me of defamation for simply connecting the dots. I also noticed that Immanuel and I have 2 common friends on Facebook :p

Well at least we've all now settled the question of whether or not this is some kind of partisan ploy: it isn't.


As for the Macdonald-Cartier Society, I don't know what to make of it:
http://macdonaldcartier.org/
There's nothing too objectionable; it pretty much conforms to the standard Red Toryism on which Canada was founded (and which, frankly, the current CPC government could do with relearning), but as Adam points out the speakers (at least those whose names I recognize) are a bit one-sided. Basically I'm having trouble matching the ill-defined mandate and various other content (civic identity, national conversation) with the events it has held. Put simply, the organization is incoherent and some of what it proposes to do is being done by the Dominion Institute anyway.



And all of this is detracting from the newest development in the renaming Wellington saga, which is that for some reason the City has been trying to consult with the feds on the issue, which was in the Sun article that Immanuel linked to in his first post:

http://www.ottawasun.com/2011/05/24/another-naming-project-for-city

[kwoldtimer]

This thread seems ready to spin off into strangeness. How about sticking to the renaming of the street? Why doesn't the idea go away?

[immanuel_smcs]

As for the Macdonald-Cartier Society, I don't know what to make of it:
http://macdonaldcartier.org/
There's nothing too objectionable; it pretty much conforms to the standard Red Toryism on which Canada was founded (and which, frankly, the current CPC government could do with relearning), but as Adam points out the speakers (at least those whose names I recognize) are a bit one-sided. Basically I'm having trouble matching the ill-defined mandate and various other content (civic identity, national conversation) with the events it has held. Put simply, the organization is incoherent and some of what it proposes to do is being done by the Dominion Institute anyway.



And all of this is detracting from the newest development in the renaming Wellington saga, which is that for some reason the City has been trying to consult with the feds on the issue, which was in the Sun article that Immanuel linked to in his first post:

http://www.ottawasun.com/2011/05/24/another-naming-project-for-city


Alright, just so we can clear the air and move on.
The organization adopted the current mission statement in May 2010 after we were officially registered as a federal non-profit.

The events to which Adam referred were held in December 2009, January 2010 and March 2010.
The event with Satya Das was Nov 2009.
These events fall under the previous mission statement.

I hope this ends this spin-off.


So...
How about renaming the Ottawa River Parkway to Macdonald-Cartier Parkway ?
It's owned by the NCC, this takes out the political process from city hall out of the equation.
There's only a few street signs to replace.
It follows the border with Quebec, so including Cartier is a good commemoration.

[Uhuniau]

If it's renamed McDonald Boulevard, they should move all the pubs to that street. Sir John A would approve.

And maybe they should turn it into a FRIGGIN' BOULEVARD.

God, this town is small-town cheap.

[Uhuniau]

Oh, I totally want to bring back the original names of Nunnery Street and Biddy Street!

[adam-machiavelli]

Oh, I totally want to bring back the original names of Nunnery Street and Biddy Street!

I approve!

In all seriousness, there are enough streets named after long dead government figures. I'd like to see streets named after the activists who improved the lives of everyone...as opposed to the fat cats who helped the people in high political office or big business. Terry Fox Drive was a good start. We should also honour recent Nobel Peace Prize winners such as Shirin Ebadi, Wangari Muta Maathai, and Liu Xiaobo.

[bikegypsy]

I approve!

In all seriousness, there are enough streets named after long dead government figures. I'd like to see streets named after the activists who improved the lives of everyone...as opposed to the fat cats who helped the people in high political office or big business. Terry Fox Drive was a good start. We should also honour recent Nobel Peace Prize winners such as Shirin Ebadi, Wangari Muta Maathai, and Liu Xiaobo.

Oh... i like the sound of that!:tup:

[reidjr]

I approve!

In all seriousness, there are enough streets named after long dead government figures. I'd like to see streets named after the activists who improved the lives of everyone...as opposed to the fat cats who helped the people in high political office or big business. Terry Fox Drive was a good start. We should also honour recent Nobel Peace Prize winners such as Shirin Ebadi, Wangari Muta Maathai, and Liu Xiaobo.

Its one thing to name major streets after canadian activists who have or did help people in canada etc its another thing if you start naming major streets after people that really had little to no impact on canada.

[rodionx]

I approve!

In all seriousness, there are enough streets named after long dead government figures. I'd like to see streets named after the activists who improved the lives of everyone...as opposed to the fat cats who helped the people in high political office or big business. Terry Fox Drive was a good start. We should also honour recent Nobel Peace Prize winners such as Shirin Ebadi, Wangari Muta Maathai, and Liu Xiaobo.

See you at Maathai and Xiaobo! Then it's off to Rigoberta Plaza for a little performance art.

Seriously, though - international names wouldn't fly - remember the proposal to name the Corktown footbridge after Nelson Mandela? Went down in flames. But then naming public infrastructure after local activists would get everyone tied up in knots. Sure, Terry Fox works, but Diane Holmes Avenue? Hmmm....

[Uhuniau]

Sure, Terry Fox works, but Diane Holmes Avenue? Hmmm....

Not nearly pretentious enough for Ottawa. It would have to be Diane Holmes Boulevard.

On a related note, I once got intercepted by a gaggle of German-speaking tourists, navigating using one of the NCC guide maps, who were anxious to visit beautiful Confederation Boulevard.

I told them they were standing on it.

Boy, did they seem disappointed.

[immanuel_smcs]

And maybe they should turn it into a FRIGGIN' BOULEVARD.

God, this town is small-town cheap.

Wellington Street should be more of a touristic street than high-traffic boulevard.

The NCC wants to run a bike path lane.

So it's not even close to being a boulevard.
They should make it a pedestrian street from Elgin to Bank.

[ServiceGuy]

Wellington Street should be more of a touristic street than high-traffic boulevard. They should make it a pedestrian street from Elgin to Bank.
Great idea... let's completely gridlock the downtown core not to mention the overwhelming success of Sparks Street Mall. :rolleyes:

[adam-machiavelli]

Its one thing to name major streets after canadian activists who have or did help people in canada etc its another thing if you start naming major streets after people that really had little to no impact on canada.

Only in Canada is this kind of petty nationalism socially acceptable.
1. Just because YOU don't think they made a difference in Canada, doesn't mean they didn't make a difference.

2. You shouldn't have to make a positive difference in Canada to be honoured here.

Regarding "Nelson Mandela Bridge", this is the first time I'd heard about that idea.

[McC]

Only in Canada is this kind of petty nationalism socially acceptable.
1. Just because YOU don't think they made a difference in Canada, doesn't mean they didn't make a difference.

2. You shouldn't have to make a positive difference in Canada to be honoured here.

Regarding "Nelson Mandela Bridge", this is the first time I'd heard about that idea.

The proposal has been circulating for a few years to rename Pretoria Bridge after Madiba. Paul Dewar (among others) has promoted it.

[m0nkyman]

Great idea... let's completely gridlock the downtown core not to mention the overwhelming success of Sparks Street Mall. :rolleyes:

Actually, moving the Pedestrian street from Sparks to Wellington and opening Sparks to traffic would be something I could get behind.

[rodionx]

The proposal has been circulating for a few years to rename Pretoria Bridge after Madiba. Paul Dewar (among others) has promoted it.

Yeah, that idea has been on a slow burn for ages. Conversely, the proposal to name the footbridge after Mandela went up and down like a rocket. This article in the Centretown News (http://centretownnewsonline.ca/archives/sep2807/News7.htm) alludes to international names being "outside the city's mandate," whatever that means.

I remember reading about a similar-sounding battle between the municipality and the federal government about whether to commemorate Igor Gouzenko with a plaque in Dundonald Park. The feds were afraid of offending Russian spies or something. In the end, the City and the feds put up separate plaques. What a town.

[Dado]

I approve!

In all seriousness, there are enough streets named after long dead government figures. I'd like to see streets named after the activists who improved the lives of everyone...as opposed to the fat cats who helped the people in high political office or big business. Terry Fox Drive was a good start. We should also honour recent Nobel Peace Prize winners such as Shirin Ebadi, Wangari Muta Maathai, and Liu Xiaobo.

How about renaming Fallowfield and Greenbank?

You see the problem with your suggestion? Given that the likely streets for such renamings or namings are bleak suburban arterials, it's an open question whether you would actually be honouring the intended honorees or not.

[reidjr]

Only in Canada is this kind of petty nationalism socially acceptable.
1. Just because YOU don't think they made a difference in Canada, doesn't mean they didn't make a difference.

2. You shouldn't have to make a positive difference in Canada to be honoured here.

Regarding "Nelson Mandela Bridge", this is the first time I'd heard about that idea.

As for its only in canada not true if you start talking about renaming a street after someone would made a big impact on that country and changing it to someone who had little to no impact well thats would not go over well.As for they should be honoured sure no question name a park after them or a street that does not have a key name etc.

[Jamaican-Phoenix]

Only in Canada is this kind of petty nationalism socially acceptable.
1. Just because YOU don't think they made a difference in Canada, doesn't mean they didn't make a difference.

2. You shouldn't have to make a positive difference in Canada to be honoured here.

Um, yes, you should. This is the capital of Canada. I don't see monuments and boulevards in Washington DC, Paris, London, Berlin, Vienna, Mexico City, Tokyo, etc. named after foreigners who made a difference in the world.

Sure, they should be honoured for their contributions, but where it makes sense.

[OttawaSteve]

Wellington Street should be more of a touristic street than high-traffic boulevard.

[...]

They should make it a pedestrian street from Elgin to Bank.

What would we do with the approximately 200 buses per hour that operate on this stretch of Wellington at peak times? (approx. 60 OC Transpo buses/hr on 6 different routes; approx. 140 STO buses/hr on 42 different routes)

[Dado]

Um, yes, you should. This is the capital of Canada. I don't see monuments and boulevards in Washington DC, Paris, London, Berlin, Vienna, Mexico City, Tokyo, etc. named after foreigners who made a difference in the world.

Sure, they should be honoured for their contributions, but where it makes sense.

Paris has an "Avenue du Président Kennedy" and it's hard to argue that President Kennedy had much of a role in French history, but President Kennedy did have a significant global role.

That said, we really have no business honouring foreigners until we've honoured our own first and not to have a prominent street named after our first prime minister is a glaring omission - it just shouldn't come at the expense of a street named after someone who was instrumental in Ottawa ultimately becoming a place at where the capital could be built (i.e. without Wellington there would be no impetus and no funding for the Rideau Canal, no Colonel By over here to build it and no reason for the town that grew up around the final lock ladder to be chosen as the capital). Few if any of us would even be here in Ottawa were it not for Wellington because the Canadian capital city would be somewhere else, probably Kingston or Montreal.

[adam-machiavelli]

Berlin also has lots of streets named after foreigners.

[immanuel_smcs]

Great idea... let's completely gridlock the downtown core not to mention the overwhelming success of Sparks Street Mall. :rolleyes:

I am sure city council can find ways to resolve gridlock without renaming Wellington Street :)

I found this a few weeks ago and it goes along what I had in mind.
A pedestrian plaza between Elgin and Bank.
And Wellington Street can be sunk in a tunnel.
http://www.ty-a.ca/Citizen/bebold.htm

[immanuel_smcs]

That said, we really have no business honouring foreigners until we've honoured our own first and not to have a prominent street named after our first prime minister is a glaring omission - it just shouldn't come at the expense of a street named after someone who was instrumental in Ottawa ultimately becoming a place at where the capital could be built (i.e. without Wellington there would be no impetus and no funding for the Rideau Canal, no Colonel By over here to build it and no reason for the town that grew up around the final lock ladder to be chosen as the capital). Few if any of us would even be here in Ottawa were it not for Wellington because the Canadian capital city would be somewhere else, probably Kingston or Montreal.



You said it great.
There exists other ways to commemorate Macdonald and Cartier, other than renaming Wellington Street.

As for no streets being named after Macdonald, I once again point out to MacDonald Street (notwithstanding the spelling mistake - no D) in Somerset Ward. It's parallel from Cartier Street and off Somerset Street.

[OttawaSteve]

I found this a few weeks ago and it goes along what I had in mind.
A pedestrian plaza between Elgin and Bank.
And Wellington Street can be sunk in a tunnel.
http://www.ty-a.ca/Citizen/bebold.htm

The proposal of a parking garage and light rail station directly under Parliament Hill -- a quaint reminder of less security-conscious times. (the article is from July 31, 2000).

[lrt's friend]

I have often wondered why the Ottawa River Parkway could not be renamed instead of streets that already have historically significant names. At the time of Pierre Trudeau's death, I thought it would have been a fitting new name to honour him, especially considering his interest in canoeing and the Canadian wilderness.

[immanuel_smcs]

What would we do with the approximately 200 buses per hour that operate on this stretch of Wellington at peak times? (approx. 60 OC Transpo buses/hr on 6 different routes; approx. 140 STO buses/hr on 42 different routes)

The is issue of re-directing the buses from Wellington Street seems external to the issue at hand.

However, having done some reading, I found out that STO/OCT are planning Rapid Bus Transit for downtown over the future.

This would mean a terminal for STO in Lebreton Flats. I guess that's where the 42 routes would stop.

Anyways, the short answer is re-direct buses from Wellington onto Albert St and Slater St.
Queen street is not wide enough to accommodate the segregated bus lane.

That's my 2 cents.

Andy Haydon exposed the idea of taking buses off Wellington Street during the 2010 campaign.