Heritage Issues

[M II A II R II K]

A thread to discuss heritage issues.

[ldoto]

DOWNTOWN



A long-vacant property in the heart of downtown has been deemed structurally unsafe, though the building's long history of decay and deterioration could soon reach a happy ending.

Just weeks after city officials issued a mandatory repair order for 142 Dundas St. -- a move that can result in a building's demolition -- the century-old structure near the John Labatt Centre has been purchased by new owners intent on fixing it up quickly.

"It's just an extraordinary building and it fully deserves the restoration it's about to receive," said Peter Mullins, the realtor who brokered the sale of the three-storey building.

"It's wonderful."

The building's pre-sale plight, though, was anything but.




It has been empty for more than a decade -- its last tenant was a Grandma Lee's restaurant -- and damage from a fire several years ago has still not been fully repaired, say city officials who posted a public safety warning on the building's windows last month.

Mullins, who listed the property for $150,000, says the new owners will take advantage of the ground floor that fronts both Dundas and Carling streets -- turning the former into a retail space and the latter into offices.

The previous owners were from outside London.

It's rare for a downtown property to be declared structurally unsound but the move in this case by city officials underscores what could become a growing problem among the core's aging building stock, said Janette MacDonald of MainStreet London.

As the old, empty commercial properties age further, she said, the main concern for downtown boosters like her could shift more and more from getting them occupied to simply keeping them safe.

The challenge, she said, is some owners bought downtown buildings in the 1960s, '70s and '80s hoping to realize huge profits as the property values skyrocketed -- except the values have steadily gone the other direction.

"That's our biggest challenge -- convincing people who paid too much on these to reinvest in them," MacDonald said. "If you do invest in it, the value will return."

To illustrate her point, MacDonald noted a downtown building that sold in 1975 for $775,000 and years later was seized by a bank, eventually hitting the market for $175,000.

But by 2003, with a solid tenant, it sold for $248,000 and after $150,000 in renovations was appraised in 2007 for $548,000.

"The value will go up but there has to be investment," she said.

So-called "orders to make safe" like the one issued by city hall against 142 Dundas St. make repairs mandatory for the owner, who may face legal action and fines of as much as $100,000 if they're not done "in a timely manner."

The ultimate decision, made by the city's chief building official, is to order a building demolished, said Frank Galera, a city building inspector.

City-wide, about one structure is ordered demolished each month, Galera said, noting the most recent case is an abandoned Lorne Ave. home that was razed in recent days.

[manny_santos]

As long as it doesn't turn into another parking lot, I'm happy. Dundas Street needs its streetscape.

[ldoto]

Old building at 142 Dundas St. in London is giving up its secrets:tup:

View larger version in photo gallery They found a fashion magazine from 1884 above the bathroom.

They found a box of old promissory notes -- including one from the "Free Press" dated Nov. 6, 1867 and apparently signed by publisher Josiah Blackburn -- in a wooden box above the second-floor ceiling.

And they found a bag of love letters -- which somebody had torn into teeny, tiny bits -- jammed beneath a floor board.

Slowly, the old building at 142 Dundas St. in London is giving up its secrets.

"Every time we do some more renovation, we find something new," says Sharon Hassan. "It's like the history of London on a smaller scale."

Hassan is helping to co-ordinate a $1-million renovation of the nearly 150-year-old building on Dundas St., just a few doors east of the Kingsmills store. Bought by Hassan Law Offices last year for $150,000, the local law firm plans to move its offices (now located at 195 Dufferin Ave.) into the downtown space by next spring.

Hassan admits she used to drive down Dundas and wonder why somebody didn't tear down some of the old, decrepit buildings dotting the street like rotten teeth. But now, she sees things differently.

"Lives were lived here and stories were told," she says. "And you can't just tear that down."

As documented in the book Downtown London: Layers of Time, edited by Michael Baker, the building was built during the 1860s by dry goods merchant Andrew Chisholm, who sold a wide range of items including clothing, caps, bonnets and parasols. In 1867 he added a clock, which now sits in the collection of Museum London, to the storefront's third floor.

Following Chisholm's retirement in 1877, the store was taken over by retailing icon Timothy Eaton's brother, James. Then in 1884 it was bought by dry goods merchant R.J. Young, who remained at the site (and in the adjoining store) until 1962.

According to information provided by Hassan's realtor, the property housed the Alexanian and Sons carpet store during the 1970s and early '80s and Grandma Lee's Bakery and Eating Place from 1985 to 1990. It's been vacant for about the past 20 years.

Clearly captivated by the history of the building, Hassan has collected an array of artifacts found within its walls, including old wooden spools, bottles, a shoe and several wire frames once used to display dresses.

One of the more fascinating finds was a bag of what appear to be torn-up love letters. Although no one has yet pieced the puzzle together, an examination of the handwritten fragments reveals words such as "hugs,"

"lips," "my darling" and "longing." Several scraps bear 1930 postmarks from Buffalo, N.Y. and Sarasota, Fla., while one shred indicates the letter was sent to a "Mrs. Helen" (the surname is missing) at an address on Dundas St.

"You can almost picture the life going on in this building," says Hassan, adding she plans to display many of the artifacts in the renovated office's reception area. "It's magical."

Hassan says that during the recent Car Free Sunday event downtown, hundreds of pedestrians trooped into the building and marvelled at what they saw.

"They just loved the building, they loved the history and they loved the story," she says. "I think people just need an opportunity to see Dundas (street) in a different light."

[seamusmcduff]

delete

[jammer139]

467-469 Dufferin Avenue - developer wins appeal to demolish.



https://lfpress.com/news/local-news/developer-wins-lengthy-battle-to-demolish-building-in-london-heritage-district/wcm/ea08b472-ffb1-4263-adbb-f2baa80908b4/

[bolognium]

I'm glad this one's coming down, and the site is being intensified a bit. The Woodfield heritage group wants that neighbourhood sealed under glass, and any development that even mildly looks to intensify the neighbourhood is completely blasted by the group.

I always find myself in the middle on heritage in this city. On one hand I hate how some of our finest heritage buildings are allowed to be demolished with few people blinking an eye, but I also hate that inconsequential, dilapidated, wood-framed, vinyl-sided buildings like this cost the owners $150,000 in legal fees just to develop them.

A lot of the heritage groups in this city cause an us vs. them dynamic. They're divisive, AND almost never save the buildings most deserving of saving. They mostly cause a stink when the building is in their neighbourhood or backyard, and are concerned about shadows and traffic. They never seem to fight for the stately downtown structures that get demolished for parking lots or developments that never materialize.

[jammer139]

Old Central Library saga - https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/london/has-shmuel-farhi-closed-the-book-on-developing-london-s-former-library-1.5941236


:whistle:

[jammer139]

A surprising move by the Landlord to sell of 231 Dundas St. Wonder what the motivation for this move is? :???:



https://cushwakeswo.com/property/229-231-dundas-street-london-2/

[inimrepus]

A surprising move by the Landlord to sell of 231 Dundas St. Wonder what the motivation for this move is? :???:

I've seen this property listed for a while now (or maybe listed multiple times). It is one of my favourite buildings downtown and I really hope it is bought by somebody who maintains the exterior of the building.

[jammer139]

The saga of the old Red Barn on 247 Halls Mill Rd. in Byron was at committee again.


https://london.ctvnews.ca/planning-committee-wants-debris-from-toppled-historic-barn-removed-by-hand-1.6321842

[jammer139]

Interesting sale of 330 Clarence Street.


Wonder who the numbered company may be????



330 Clarence Street
type Heritage apartment building
price $3,600,000
seller Spriet Investments Inc.
buyer 1000449275 Ontario Inc.

[inimrepus]

I hope this building is kept in good condition, it has always been a building that I loved the look of

[MolsonExport]

Interesting sale of 330 Clarence Street.


Wonder who the numbered company may be????



330 Clarence Street
type Heritage apartment building
price $3,600,000
seller Spriet Investments Inc.
buyer 1000449275 Ontario Inc.

Farhi?
The man that loves empty buildings, and seems to frown on tenants. Somehow, he earns money.

[GreatTallNorth2]

Tricar is due for another downtown project.

[Spoofy]

.

[Djeffery]

I hope this building is kept in good condition, it has always been a building that I loved the look of

Always loved the creeky floors when I went there in the 80's as a teen to buy running shoes. Those women always remember exactly what it was I was after even after a few months.

[Djeffery]

Tricar is due for another downtown project.

They could probably fit a building similar to 195 Dundas on that property. Make a deal with Citiplaza for parking (even though really, that parking garage could likely be knocked down and a decent size floorplan put there with underground parking). Hopefully if it is a developer, they incorporate the facade into a new build.

[bolognium]

Regardless of who bought the building, they'd better not fuck with it. One of the more unique apartment buildings we have downtown. A few of my friends had apartments in Sterling Place, and they were wonderful spaces. Massive windows, gorgeous hardwood floors, high ceilings, exposed duct-work. Just a really cool building all around. Plus the exterior is fantastic and really makes that corner interesting.

Would genuinely upset me to see this fall to facadectomy when it's currently a functional building with people happily living in it.

[jammer139]

Elgin Manor in Mt Elgin was demolished today to make way for the subdivision being built.



https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/london/beyond-devastating-12-days-after-council-vote-wrecking-ball-takes-elgin-hall-1.6828341


https://london.ctvnews.ca/video?clipId=2678178

[jammer139]

John Clark house gets plaques.


https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/london/19th-century-london-ont-landmark-now-a-heritage-building-1.6863593

[jammer139]

Corporate Services committee discussing the proposal to declare 652 Elizabeth Street as surplus and sell it off. This is a 3s heritage building immediately north of the CP railway and east of McMahen Park. No doubt whoever would purchase this would need to spend alot of money to renovate it. Hopefully it finds a new owner and purpose. There is enough land on the lot that a developer could consider a high rise tower incorporating the heritage building with a creative architect involved.



https://pub-london.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=99849

[jammer139]

Yet another example of the heritage nuts getting it wrong. :koko:



https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/london/london-ontario-heritage-cottage-39-carfrae-1.6892742

[jammer139]

PEC hearing the debate on 39 Carfrae St easement.


https://pub-london.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=100685

[Books4everyone]

Interesting sale of 330 Clarence Street.


Wonder who the numbered company may be????



330 Clarence Street
type Heritage apartment building
price $3,600,000
seller Spriet Investments Inc.
buyer 1000449275 Ontario Inc.

Regardless of who bought the building, they'd better not fuck with it. One of the more unique apartment buildings we have downtown. A few of my friends had apartments in Sterling Place, and they were wonderful spaces. Massive windows, gorgeous hardwood floors, high ceilings, exposed duct-work. Just a really cool building all around. Plus the exterior is fantastic and really makes that corner interesting.

Would genuinely upset me to see this fall to facadectomy when it's currently a functional building with people happily living in it.

Here's the 411 (or some of it). (Yes, I made this account to share this info.)

The new owner of the property is not Farhi, but the new owner has expressed a desire to evict all the current tenants. Initially, he informed them about plans to convert the building into a hotel, but the absence of parking facilities similar to nearby hotels made this idea questionable. Subsequently, he mentioned wanting to transform the building into short-term accommodations, but the City's Short-Term Accommodations (STA) by-law limits the number of permitted apartments to two, with the requirement that the owner must reside in the building.

As the new owner has made changing statements, the current tenants find themselves uncertain about his true intentions for the property.

The new owner has already undertaken significant changes to the building. He ripped up the century-old wood flooring, opting for a modernization approach by painting the interior ceiling black and the rest of the apartment white. Furthermore, he installed stainless steel appliances like a fridge and stove. The building's exterior is also undergoing renovation, where the owner's painting scheme is visible. They could have kept the historical hardwood floors, which could have been preserved and restored. They exist in apartments where people haven't moved out.

Tenants have piss-poor living conditions in common areas and the building's historical integrity at stake due to the new owner's actions and plans.

Owner:
I do know the name of the new owner, but I'm not sure if posting the name will get me banned (re: doxxing). The new owner has a well-established track record of purchasing properties and flipping them for significant profits before moving on to other buildings.

Owner's helpers:
I know the names of these people, but unsure to post if doxxing.

flipper
The current owner of the property decided to collaborate with another real estate flipper who follows the popular YouTube BRRR method (Buy, Rent, Rehab, Refinance). This strategy involves purchasing a property, renovating or rehabilitating it to increase its value, then renting it out to generate rental income. After these upgrades and renovations are complete, they proceed to refinance the property. By doing so, they can access additional capital based on the increased value of the building resulting from the improvements made.

paralegal
The current owner of the property took further steps to evict by enlisting the assistance of a paralegal. This paralegal, along with the hired flipper, approached the tenants in an attempt to convince them to move out.

Tactics used by the owner's team were horrible and caused concerns among the tenants. They offered vastly different amounts of compensation to different tenants, creating an inequitable situation. Moreover, they promised to assist with the moving process, but neglected to mention that the moving costs would be deducted from the compensation offered.

Also, they demanded leaving tenants sign non-disclosure agreements, preventing them from discussing the situation with others. They also used emotional appeals, like sharing a "sob story" about high mortgage costs and the need for tenants to leave before December. They also claimed that tenants would face eviction if they chose not to leave voluntarily by December, adding pressure and uncertainty to the situation.

Interior conditions:
The current owner appears to be neglecting regular cleaning and maintenance of the interior of the building, resulting in a roach infestation.

In their efforts to renovate vacant apartments, the owner's team is leaving construction materials scattered throughout the building. This includes chemical spills in the elevator, as well as screws and nails left on the ground, posing potential safety hazards for the residents and their pets.

Additionally, the owner has implemented changes to utilities and amenities. Electricity and water meters have been installed in individual units, leading tenants to speculate that they may start being charged separately for these costs, despite rent previously being inclusive of utilities.

The owner replaced the existing laundry machines with ones that he now owns, but the new dryers are not functional, depriving tenants of laundry facilities they previously had access to.

The combination of poor maintenance, pest issues, and insufficient amenities is causing frustration and discomfort among the tenants.

Property Managers:

The new owner got rid of the live in property manager.
Hired Trident Property Managers (https://www.tridentmanagement.ca/) - then fired them when the owner wanted to do something he shouldn't and they resisted [Trident said no to his dishonest/illegal(?) actions]
Now uses a couple people with sketchy backgrounds. Doesn't reply to emails, refuses to give required information.


London, ON city help:
Efforts to address the issues with the building and the owner's actions have yielded mixed results. While some steps have been taken to seek intervention from the city and local representatives, the overall progress has been slow and frustrating.

City departments have been notified about the violations within the units, but their response has been slow af, causing delays.

In attempts to seek assistance, residents have reached out to their Ward 13 councillor and Member of Provincial Parliament (MPP) for the area. These representatives went into the building to speak directly with the affected residents, and dropped off letters to them.

However, despite these efforts, there seem to be limitations in what the city and the province can do to address the issues effectively.

Results:

Some tenants are waiting for the next shoe to drop: unsure what will happen. If someone wants to buy the bulding - okay. Renovate empty apartments and charge more - Fine. But the tactics, dishonesty, and outright lies to get people out of their home is wrong. It will drive up costs for everyone in the city too.

Unsure now if 1000449275 Ontario Inc. being the same as London Canada Rentals. The names seemed to be used interchangeably by managers.

[jammer139]

The Heritage Assessment for the rebuild of the old Black Walnut Bakery at 134 Wortley Rd. :cheers:



The owner and city planners are working to rebuild the building that was destroyed by arson.



https://pub-london.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=101462

[tyeman200]

London, ON city help:
Efforts to address the issues with the building and the owner's actions have yielded mixed results. While some steps have been taken to seek intervention from the city and local representatives, the overall progress has been slow and frustrating.

City departments have been notified about the violations within the units, but their response has been slow af, causing delays.

In attempts to seek assistance, residents have reached out to their Ward 13 councillor and Member of Provincial Parliament (MPP) for the area. These representatives went into the building to speak directly with the affected residents, and dropped off letters to them.

However, despite these efforts, there seem to be limitations in what the city and the province can do to address the issues effectively.


THIS is why I hate this city with a passion.

Stuff like this should be met with the owners getting massive fines and what not.

[jammer139]

PEC votes to remove two properties from heritage registry.


https://london.ctvnews.ca/councillors-frustrated-vacant-homes-left-to-rot-during-housing-crisis-1.6567709

[jammer139]

Catholic Board wants to demolish Regina Mundi High School to get MOE permission to build a new school. First they need to get if removed from heritage list. School currently has 700 students.





https://lfpress.com/news/local-news/wrecking-ball-looms-for-regina-mundi-catholic-college-school-board

[Books4everyone]

Further to my post of July 26th, 2023 (https://skyscraperpage.com/forum/showpost.php?p=10000615&postcount=25) I am submitting more information backing up what I said and regarding recent issues the tenants are facing.

In the upcoming weeks or months, I intend to share information because, in my view, the landlord's activities are suspicious. To safeguard the anonymity of the individuals reporting these issues, certain details will be redacted. At times, I may employ artificial intelligence to rephrase my own text in order to protect my own identity, given my direct involvement.

Regarding my previous claim about tenants being threatened with eviction:
Here is a copy of what someone received which suggested that the only options the tenants had were to take the landlord's offer or be evicted (https://imgur.com/a/Cz8py4b). People believed them and left their homes to avoid eviction. James in the letter is James Fernandez from Youtube videos (https://www.youtube.com/@fernandezinvestments6829) about flipping properties, and the person is in other videos (https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=james+fernandez+london+ontario), and a CBC article (https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/london/he-s-31-and-purchased-20-properties-in-2-years-here-s-how-he-did-it-1.6379879).

Apologies if the image appears small or is oversized. It's been a while since I used phpBB.

New issue:
The landlord is saying they will shut off heat and hot water to the building for days (https://imgur.com/a/6JRuq76) during Nov-Dec '23. I think that it's just another way to get the tenants to want to move out: 'make things miserable for tenants so they leave and more money can be charged to the new tenant'.

The landlord hasn't answered questions about the length of the disruption (if there will be no heat or hot water for 5 continuous days, or if it will be off in periods over 5 days).

THIS is why I hate this city with a passion.

Stuff like this should be met with the owners getting massive fines and what not.

Apparently, the city doesn't have a whole lot of power to do anything. It falls under the province for most things and D. Ford doesn't care.

[jammer139]

Proposal to demolish the house at 187 Wharncliffe Road North and rebuild a new house.



https://pub-london.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=104366

[tyeman200]

Catholic Board wants to demolish Regina Mundi High School to get MOE permission to build a new school. First they need to get if removed from heritage list. School currently has 700 students.





https://lfpress.com/news/local-news/wrecking-ball-looms-for-regina-mundi-catholic-college-school-board

I didn't even realize the school was on the historic registry. I think it would be nice if they could keep the Chapel portion up, it is the only thing worth saving.

[jammer139]

CTV story on vacant derelict homes that may be demolished soon.


https://london.ctvnews.ca/i-am-very-unsafe-elderly-widow-urges-city-hall-to-demolish-derelict-house-next-door-1.6639051

[jammer139]

Nice historical photo of the city centre towers being built in 1973-74 posted.


:tup:

https://www.reddit.com/r/londonontario/comments/18ojwwp/city_centre_towers_197374/

[jammer139]

Government bureaucracy wastes time and money. :hell:



This is a classic example of pure stupidity. :koko:



https://lfpress.com/news/local-news/government-delays-stall-londoners-plan-to-build-new-house-so-much-red-tape