Protesters disrupt Olympic Spirit Train sendoff

[mr.x]

First Nations protest groups intend to sabotage the Olympic Spirit Train's trip across the country by having protests at each of its stops:
http://media.canada.com/2de3e3f6-b472-4835-9142-3ead50913788/cp19.jpg

Sprit Train official website: http://www.cpspirittrain.com/



http://a123.g.akamai.net/f/123/12465/1d/media.canada.com/6e9fe79e-c481-414d-8db7-5b24ff08866b/prv0921n%20olympicspirittrain.jpg
Protesters disrupt Olympic Spirit Train kickoff

By Ian Austin, Vancouver Province
Published: Sunday, September 21, 2008

Police arrested two people Sunday as protesters armed with placards, air horns and megaphones overpowered the kickoff of the Canadian Pacific Spirit Train in Port Moody.

Shouting "Homes, no games!" and drowning out the scheduled entertainment, the noisy protesters chanted for more than an hour. The performers continually turned up the volume, but were eventually unable to proceed.

"I think the idea is to make some f---in' noise here," said Garth Mullins, a fixture at anti-Olympic protests. "They're trying to drown us out, so let's drown them out."

The Spirit Train is scheduled to travel to 10 communities across Canada, carrying activities and exhibits related to the Vancouver 2010 Games. Vancouver's Colin James is among the performers participating.

As the show began Sunday under the watchful eye of dozens of police officers, the protesters positioned two large banners directly in front of the stage so nobody could see the featured entertainment.

Kelly Worrall, a spectator, intervened and hauled down the sign down so the crowd could see.

"I'm not politically motivated, I'm just trying to see the show," Worrall said. "Freedom only goes as far as when it affects me. You can't accept this type of behaviour."

Colin Hansen, the B.C. minister responsible for the Olympics, huddled with aides and Canadian Pacific staff to decide whether to go on stage with the protesters so close.

"I think it shows the strength of Canadian democracy, that there's room for protesters. It's a shame that a small number of protesters can ruin this for the vast majority," Hansen said.

"They claim to be in favour of First Nations, but they're shouting down an aboriginal band on stage."

Police moved in at 3 p.m., handcuffing a man and carrying him to the back of a police van. Another woman moved in to help the first man. She was handcuffed while protesters shouted that the man had been assaulted by a media cameraman.

The protesters moved over to the Canadian Pacific corporate tent at about 3:15 p.m., where they shouted anti-Olympic slogans next to a table where families were collecting autographed postcards.

Police had to restrain a woman who tried to snatch a megaphone from one of the protesters, but eventually the group retreated and left the event at about 3:30 p.m.

Charges have not been laid against the man and woman arrested.






Protests to trail 2010 Olympic Spirit Train route

Updated Fri. Sep. 19 2008 1:46 PM ET
The Canadian Press

VANCOUVER -- An event designed to drum up enthusiasm for the 2010 Winter Games in Vancouver is set to begin amid threats of nationwide protests.

Canadian Pacific's Spirit Train is scheduled to leave Port Moody, B.C., on Sunday for a 10-city tour and activists say they'll be at every stop.

"Across the country people have an understanding the Olympics has created (and) perpetuated, displacement, homelessness, destruction of the environment and increasing theft of indigenous land," said Harsha Walia of the Olympic Resistance Network, which is spearheading the call for national protests.

Opposition to the Olympic Games has been constant since Vancouver was awarded the bid in 2003 but some protest groups say their membership is getting stronger as the Games near.

"I think its fair to say that many communities, urban, rural and remote are becoming more educated about the oppression the Olympics brings, especially with all the media coverage in Beijing," said Angela Sterritt of Native 2010 Resistance, which is connected to the resistance network.

First Nations activists have been vocal in their opposition to the Games, saying they are being held illegally on traditional territories.

It's an attitude organizers have worked hard to try and counter.

The federal government has signed agreements worth billions of dollars with the four bands whose traditional territories are home to the Games and with whom Olympic organizers have also built official relationships.

Aboriginal themes weave through much of the 2010 Olympic designs and aboriginal artists will be playing at the Spirit Train events.

But the train is still chugging on dangerous tracks -- blocking rail lines has become a favoured tactic of native leaders, though activists wouldn't disclose the exact nature of any Spirit Train protests.

"Rail right of ways continue to trespass reserves and are the subject of specific claims," said Sterritt.

"It is fitting that a train trip is used to spread the `Olympic spirit,' in that rail was a harbinger of cultural destruction and is today continuing that legacy via the 2010 Winter Olympics."

Both CP and the Vancouver organizing committee said they're prepared for protests.

"We also hope the people recognize the need for peaceful protest if you feel compelled to do that, things that don't disrupt certainly wouldn't disrupt the business of CP or other rail users but don't endanger the people," said Maureen Douglas, director of community relations for the committee.

"This is about bringing the spirit of the Olympic and Paralympic movement."

Although the Spirit Train protests could be seen as a test run for potential protests around the Olympic torch relay which will begin late in 2009, activists say that is not the case.

The rail company said it hopes that if there are protests, they remain under control.

"We understand people's right to protest and we hope that they do it peacefully," said Breanne Feigel, a spokeswoman for CP.

"This is a family event and it's a free family event for everybody and really the goal of the Olympic Spirit train and CP's programming is to be all inclusive."

The train will start in Port Moody and stop in Calgary, Edmonton, Saskatoon, Winnipeg, Thunder Bay, Sudbury, Mississauga and Smith Falls, Ont., before ending its journey in Montreal on Oct. 18.

The day-long festivities around each stop will showcase local and Canadian talents like Colin James and feature mini-Olympic villages where visitors can try out a luge start or get their photograph taken as if ski jumping.

The Spirit Train will make a repeat journey in the fall of 2009 and potentially after the Games as a tour for medallists.

CP Rail, as the official rail freight services supplier to the 2010 Vancouver Games, paid somewhere between $3 million and $15 million for the sponsorship, in exchange for access to tickets and the use of Olympic trademarks for such promotional events.









Do these people have anything better to do? The Olympics, if anything, have benefited the First Nations of B.C. with nearly a hundred million dollars going towards local bands. And the First Nations are being represented very much in 2010.

As well, these Games are happening whether they like it or not.....

Really, these people are losers and we need to re-write our laws into making protests non-disruptive only, not just peaceful protests. It's the same as thinking you can bring in an air horn into a concert and try to disrupt the performance. This is just ridiculous and disgusting:

- Shouting "Homes, no games!" and drowning out the scheduled entertainment, the noisy protesters chanted for more than an hour. The performers continually turned up the volume, but were eventually unable to proceed.

- "I think the idea is to make some f---in' noise here," said Garth Mullins, a fixture at anti-Olympic protests. "They're trying to drown us out, so let's drown them out."

- As the show began Sunday under the watchful eye of dozens of police officers, the protesters positioned two large banners directly in front of the stage so nobody could see the featured entertainment.

- The protesters moved over to the Canadian Pacific corporate tent at about 3:15 p.m., where they shouted anti-Olympic slogans next to a table where families were collecting autographed postcards.

[mr.x]

Here's a news report of the protest: http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/C...ishColumbiaHome (http://www.ctvbc.ctv.ca/servlet/an/local/CTVNews/20080921/BC_2010_train_protest_080921/20080921/?hub=BritishColumbiaHome)


It's pretty disgusting....kids were even crying. How are we even allowing these protests to happen? They are nothing but peaceful, they are completely disruptive and in this case resulted in the entire kickoff event to be called off.

And then this retard girl protester started saying, "there's no reason for her to bring children into a protest zone - that is not intelligent". Girl, first of all this is a family event that you're ruining....

[Yume-sama]

Seems they did go a bit too far. It's unfortunate they allowed them to continue and ruin the entire event.

Oooh... Canada.

[Metro-One]

I must agree. I believe in free speech but there is a time and a place for everything, and this was not it. A peaceful protest, yes, but one of this nature, no. There is a thing called respect, and at times respect should even be given to your enemies. People like this only bring more damage than good to their cause, when will they learn that? They only come off as selfish, arrogant lazy bastards who's only purpose in life is to be destructive.

[SpongeG]

the games are a done deal

are these people that stupid? that they think the gam,es money will all of a sudden go to housing?

[dreambrother808]

I think that the protests are a bit much and drum up opposition as opposed to support for their cause;
however, their presence is still far preferable to silencing opposition.
To interpret this as a flaw in the Canadian way of life is to invite a much scarier reality.
Perhaps there is some middle road. Regulate the protest in some way that makes it less distracting??
I don't know. If that's possible at least...

[Yume-sama]

No, they don't REALLY think the games will be canceled. It just makes them feel important and gives them something to do other than playing World of Warcraft in the parents' basement while collecting welfare and not looking for a job.

[SpongeG]

lol

[Metro-One]

Well that is what i am saying, you have the right to protest, but no one has the right to be an asshole. Protesters should be given a segment of time to say what they need to say, but then allow the event to carry on after without destroying it. I feel give them a few minutes open forum, then tell them they have to be quiet during the ceremonies. The problem is these protestors have no manners and are too immature to handle such a proposition.

[Chioster]

Sad part is, these are the same people who try to reap the government benefits like welfare, and social housing. They believe it is a right for them to be poor and accept these things. How about they should all get a job and make their own money to BUY their own houses instead of believing they should get it all for free. If they are saying they are disabled and can't work, than it is a shame since they were wrestling the police pretty well.

That women who made the kids cry was like "you shouldn't bring your kids to a protesting zone" excuse me? WHAT PROTESTING ZONE? I thought this was a family sanctioned EVENT. These people should get an education and a job instead of believing it is a right to be homeless and reap the benefits of the government when we are working our butts off trying to maintain our family.

I for one wish Canada had a secret police, not CSIS since CSIS is just there to find terrorist but a secret police that has the authority to arrest people like the APC or these people against their will because, these are the same people (APC) who do things that just ruins it for everyone including disruption of peace and wasting our money on more security. You want more money? You want more investment? Than you stop wasting THE MONEY on security because you idiots cannot contain yourself. THE GAMES ARE HERE TO STAY. What do you expect? they cancel the game to build your social housing?

[Metro-One]

Generally people who protest these types of events, especially this late in development, are usually losers who have nothing better to do. I believe in socialism, but unfortunatly in any program there are those who abuse it. The funny thing is the Olympics are actually bringing them more money. With the world watching the government wants to clean up the city and make it look like we are doing a good job. Trust me, without the olympics i doubt the Canada Line would be built and odds are none of the recent social housing towers projects would exist.

[mr.x]

Our protest laws need to be rewritten.....not only should protests be peaceful, they need to also be non-disruptive.

[zivan56]

Isn't this considered "creating a public disturbance" banging pots and whatnot? "Protest zone"? LOL
I supporting peaceful protesting, but Metro Vancouver police forces should require a "protest license" to be obtained like they do in places like Moscow. Otherwise, protestors should be arrested for things like blocking streets, creating noise, littering, noise, etc...

[Dorian G.]

the games are a done deal

are these people that stupid? that they think the [games] money will all of a sudden go to housing?
Maybe they assume that since the government has money for a socialist boondoggle like the olypics they have money for social housing as well?

It's entirely true that these protests are incompatible with the format the games' organizers have constructed for display; what better weapon against protests do organizers have than to create a "family-friendly" space--one where protests are socially unacceptable because of their impacts on children? (Crying children = ironclad proof that THe Protseters ar evil!!1!). However, protest by nature must be unconstrained; who didn't scoff at the handful of parks where protesting was allowed in Beijing? (or think of the "free speech" cage in Arrested Development). The visceral reactions so many of you give to the protesters (let's call them "free speech in action") reveals the problem they represent: Southwest BC likes to claim the existence of (and its central role in) a "westcoast liberalism," but this breaks down with any threat to the more typical "wild-west" ideology that really monopolizes our discourse. It's no coincidence that The Province, a populist tabloid, will be the most one-sided and childish in its coverage of dissent.

There's no evidence that the protesters are on welfare, and even less that they play WOW (it's infinitely likely online forum-members play), so let's avoid talking about the people and focus on the act of protest and whether or not we recognize its importance.

[canucks23]

^
That was really not cool what they did though. How can you justify that and think it was o.k!

How would you feel if you were a kid being swarmed buy random guys yelling, screaming and slamming pots in your face while your at a family event. How would you feel if that was happening to your children.

[Stingray2004]

Saw the incident on the 6:00 pm news.

And who crawled out from under his rock but APEC protestor Garth Mullins, one of the instigators.

"I think the idea is to make some f---in' noise here," said Garth Mullins, a fixture at anti-Olympic protests.

http://www.cbc.ca/gfx/photos/mullins_garth010806.jpg

And from Garth's own blog he describes his interests as:

revolution, resistance, anti-imperialsim, smashing capitalism

Sure are a lot of winners out there. :rolleyes:

[mr.x]

^
That was really not cool what they did though. How can you justify that and think it was o.k!

How would you feel if you were a kid being swarmed buy random guys yelling, screaming and slamming pots in your face while your at a family event. How would you feel if that was happening to your children.

Just ignore Dorian....

[Distill3d]

Our protest laws need to be rewritten.....not only should protests be peaceful, they need to also be non-disruptive.

i agree our protest should be peaceful, but as for non-disruptive, thats the object of a protest is to disrupt the cause you are protesting against is it not? i mean if i can disrupt someones day enough that he's going to hear what i have to say about whatever issue is near to my heart in order to have a positive change, i would consider it protesting. i myself have marched in anti war rallies that are organized, but do end up disrupting the flow of traffic and transit. however, none have been violent, and the local authorities have been there to aide and assist.

Sad part is, these are the same people who try to reap the government benefits like welfare, and social housing. They believe it is a right for them to be poor and accept these things. How about they should all get a job and make their own money to BUY their own houses instead of believing they should get it all for free. If they are saying they are disabled and can't work, than it is a shame since they were wrestling the police pretty well.

That women who made the kids cry was like "you shouldn't bring your kids to a protesting zone" excuse me? WHAT PROTESTING ZONE? I thought this was a family sanctioned EVENT. These people should get an education and a job instead of believing it is a right to be homeless and reap the benefits of the government when we are working our butts off trying to maintain our family.

I for one wish Canada had a secret police, not CSIS since CSIS is just there to find terrorist but a secret police that has the authority to arrest people like the APC or these people against their will because, these are the same people (APC) who do things that just ruins it for everyone including disruption of peace and wasting our money on more security. You want more money? You want more investment? Than you stop wasting THE MONEY on security because you idiots cannot contain yourself. THE GAMES ARE HERE TO STAY. What do you expect? they cancel the game to build your social housing?

i would lay good money down that the majority of these individuals do live below or around the "poverty line", but all probably have food in their stomachs, and a roof over there head. suffice to say, these people probably have jobs that pay the living wage for Vancouver. i'm going to go out on a limb here and venture to say that these protesters also have reasonable access to the internet, and have never spent a night on the streets, or in line for a bowl of soup at a soup kitchen.

however, some of these are the same people who try to reap the benefits of things like Welfare and Social Housing and believe that the world should be free. for whatever reason they blame the rest of us on the fact that they cannot maintain employment or find a decent and/or affordable place to live.

i seriously wonder how many of these protesters actually reside in the DTES or are fortunate enough to be able to get into the shelters here like the Catholic Charity's? and how many of these are people are "professional protesters" (people who move from city to city, cause to cause)?

[Chioster]

i agree our protest should be peaceful, but as for non-disruptive, thats the object of a protest is to disrupt the cause you are protesting against is it not? i mean if i can disrupt someones day enough that he's going to hear what i have to say about whatever issue is near to my heart in order to have a positive change, i would consider it protesting. i myself have marched in anti war rallies that are organized, but do end up disrupting the flow of traffic and transit. however, none have been violent, and the local authorities have been there to aide and assist.



i would lay good money down that the majority of these individuals do live below or around the "poverty line", but all probably have food in their stomachs, and a roof over there head. suffice to say, these people probably have jobs that pay the living wage for Vancouver. i'm going to go out on a limb here and venture to say that these protesters also have reasonable access to the internet, and have never spent a night on the streets, or in line for a bowl of soup at a soup kitchen.

however, some of these are the same people who try to reap the benefits of things like Welfare and Social Housing and believe that the world should be free. for whatever reason they blame the rest of us on the fact that they cannot maintain employment or find a decent and/or affordable place to live.

i seriously wonder how many of these protesters actually reside in the DTES or are fortunate enough to be able to get into the shelters here like the Catholic Charity's? and how many of these are people are "professional protesters" (people who move from city to city, cause to cause)?

I was saying more on the lines of the APC. I bet you 90% of the APC are residents of the DTES and surrounding areas.

[djmk]

wow, some of you are blasting off some dangerous stuff. Chioster wants secret police and the rest of you want the laws changed.

one day a real issue may arise where we are all forced to take action (ie a really corrupt gov't, a dangerous policy...) and we can't because there is no way for our voices to be heard.

i agree, these protesters should show some class, but a few crying babies is well worth this freedom.

besides, the police know who are protesting, breaking laws, and spray painting clocks. i am sure they have a list of offenses that this Mullins had done. and i predict, a week before the olympics, they will be rounded up and before a judge held accountable for their actions.

[WarrenC12]

It's pretty disgusting....kids were even crying. How are we even allowing these protests to happen? They are nothing but peaceful, they are completely disruptive and in this case resulted in the entire kickoff event to be called off.

That's terrible. I think they need to plaster those kids crying and some of the other stupid things these idiots have done all over TV and the news. Then next time there is a public event and some of these idiots show up, people will remember what they saw on the news last time, and there will be more of the public tearing down their banners, yelling at them, etc. A little dose of their own medicine.


Sad part is, these are the same people who try to reap the government benefits like welfare, and social housing. They believe it is a right for them to be poor and accept these things. How about they should all get a job and make their own money to BUY their own houses instead of believing they should get it all for free. If they are saying they are disabled and can't work, than it is a shame since they were wrestling the police pretty well.

Absolutely!

This warrants re-watching/listening, these people are totally living in fantasy land.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4RyjtdNzII :haha:

Still taking applications for my Anti-APC group!

[WBC]

This is awesome: Rich Olympic oligarch kids vs. spoiled welfare kids. The battle of the irrelevant cry babies on taxpayers dime. I only wish that both parties could get the hell away from downtown, so I could live my life in peace.

[240glt]

All this poses some interesting questions about the future of olympics in general. No doubt the Van 2010 winter games will proceed as planned with some protest and perhaps disruptions along the way. It apprears, though, that we're reaching a point with all olympics (Bejing being the latest best example) where massive public funding for facilities and infrastructure that ultimately benefits private companies the most is reaching dizzying perportions. I won't go so far as to say what the protestors are doing is right or wrong, as a former activist I can empathize with the positions that these protesters have taken, But I also think that both sides need to take a pragmatic look at how events like the olympics are funded, and how the people who have nothing to gain by having a venue like the olympics in their communities are affected.

Lets face facts here, the olympics are revenue generators. It stopped being about athletes a long time ago. That's the biggest problem I have with the games, and the ultimate winners in these games will be the large corporations that generate massive amounts of revenue from publicly funded projects. At the end of the day, host olympic cities end up with olympic quality sports and convention facilities as well as other infrastructure, but it appears that over the past few olympics that the lust for bigger, better and more grandiose facilities is getting out of hand, Especially as they're being built out of the public purse.

[MalcolmTucker]

wow, some of you are blasting off some dangerous stuff. Chioster wants secret police and the rest of you want the laws changed.

one day a real issue may arise where we are all forced to take action (ie a really corrupt gov't, a dangerous policy...) and we can't because there is no way for our voices to be heard.

i agree, these protesters should show some class, but a few crying babies is well worth this freedom.

besides, the police know who are protesting, breaking laws, and spray painting clocks. i am sure they have a list of offenses that this Mullins had done. and i predict, a week before the olympics, they will be rounded up and before a judge held accountable for their actions.
Protests like this I guess are ok in some contexts. However if CP did rent out the WCE station they were using, they should have the right to exclude or remove anyone they want. Private property rights go above all else in this one. Think about if these people bought all the seats in front of cameras in venues and help up huge anti olympic banners (of course while enjoying the events themselves).

[djmk]

All this poses some interesting questions about the future of olympics in general. No doubt the Van 2010 winter games will proceed as planned with some protest and perhaps disruptions along the way. It apprears, though, that we're reaching a point with all olympics (Bejing being the latest best example) where massive public funding for facilities and infrastructure that ultimately benefits private companies the most is reaching dizzying perportions. I won't go so far as to say what the protestors are doing is right or wrong, as a former activist I can empathize with the positions that these protesters have taken, But I also think that both sides need to take a pragmatic look at how events like the olympics are funded, and how the people who have nothing to gain by having a venue like the olympics in their communities are affected.

Lets face facts here, the olympics are revenue generators. It stopped being about athletes a long time ago. That's the biggest problem I have with the games, and the ultimate winners in these games will be the large corporations that generate massive amounts of revenue from publicly funded projects. At the end of the day, host olympic cities end up with olympic quality sports and convention facilities as well as other infrastructure, but it appears that over the past few olympics that the lust for bigger, better and more grandiose facilities is getting out of hand, Especially as they're being built out of the public purse.

"private companies" need to get paid for the work that they do. of course larger projects have larger costs and risks, but there is no evidence that any of the companies creating any of the infrastructure are making obscene profits nor is their any evidence that these corps are not paying their taxes.

furthermore, the revenue from the games is going to VANOC which also pays the bills of hosting the games. the revenue consists of ticket sales, gov't funding and corporate sponsorship.
now, you might not like the corps who are giving the money (McD's, RBC, Bell, etc) but they are giving huge amounts of money away at a considerable risk. i heard that the sponsors of Bejing got royally screwed when tight security prevented people from properly experience their promotions.

i think you can make the argument that we need most of the infrastructure coming to us. Richmond got a killer community Center, Vancouver is getting upgrades to a shitty arena and a cool convention centre, and perhaps the embarrassment of the DTES will get the politicians moving. These items enhance our city and prehaps create revenue into the future.

Where we lose money will be on the operational costs of 2010, however, hopefully the goodwill created by the olympics will pay future dividends.

[Jason0924]

Lets face facts here, the olympics are revenue generators. It stopped being about athletes a long time ago. That's the biggest problem I have with the games, and the ultimate winners in these games will be the large corporations that generate massive amounts of revenue from publicly funded projects. At the end of the day, host olympic cities end up with olympic quality sports and convention facilities as well as other infrastructure, but it appears that over the past few olympics that the lust for bigger, better and more grandiose facilities is getting out of hand, Especially as they're being built out of the public purse.

First off I agree that a pragmatic approach to these issues should rule the day, but no offense 240glt your opinion about corporate greed is the inherent problem with the motivation behind these protests. The Olympics are simply a lightening rod for the bigger motivation of these people which is anti-establishment, anti-capitalism and anarchy. If the world was perfect these people would still find something to protest. It is their purpose in life. I will bet all my hard-earned money that someone with just a small basis of knowledge would dismantle any of these protesters in a one-on-one debate. Logic and rationality is not a language they understand. Their basis of power is mob-mentality, not reason and discourse.

Back to the question you raised regarding the Olympics being a revenue generator. My counter-question: Why is this a problem? Don't get me wrong, I'm not some right-wing neo-con. I believe in a healthy balance of capitalism and socialism which I think we have for the most part in Canada, but the basis of our economic system is still dependent on businesses making money, which in-turn creates tax revenue, as well as jobs, which in-turn creates more tax revenue, etc.

Specific to the Olympics, let's put this into perspective:

1. Before the 1984 games in LA there were no Olympic sponsors, thus 100% of the cost to run the games was fitted by the host city/nation (can you say Montreal).

2. So that begs the question: Would eliminating corporate sponsorship and thus having to pay for the entire games out of your tax dollars make it feel more about the athletes, or would you rather them leverage the unbelievable viewership the games gets around the world to garner revenue from willing corporate sponsors? Even a bantam hockey tournament welcomes sponsors, and watching the Bejing games I for one got the spirit of the athletes and the games and didn't get a sense of corporate influence. It should also be noted that sponsors aren't allowed to have a presence on the field of play. So other than the likes of Coke and GM being able to leverage logos and good will in their advertising or at stores they aren't visible during the games (like any sporting event you can always flip when the commercials come on to go grab a beer or whatever).

That said, I do agree with you on your grandiose statement when watching Bejing. It was certainly evident that the centralized government spent billions from their national purse to impress the world. Contrary though that definitely isn't happening for our games.

3. For the 2010 games, of the $1.6 billion budget only 26% is coming from public funding, and 100% of that portion of the budget is going to construction of venues. Venues which the public will be able to use after and which will continue to generate revenue.

4. To the question of displacement caused by said construction, don't believe the hype. The Olympic construction budget is roughly $500 million over 4 years of building. Construction spending as an industry in the Lower Mainland is in the BILLIONS of dollars per year. In other words, Olympic construction is a drop in the bucket in the larger picture (of course this doesn't include pseudo-projects like the Sea to Sky and Canada Line but whether that should be included is debatable. Either way they were needed and have created thousands of jobs).

So really what it comes down to is protesting anything that sniffs of establishment and capitalism. It comes from the mentality that if 'you have something you're naturally taking it away from me.' the problem is they always fail to see the bigger picture and cause-and-effect. Details be damned! They're going to protest no matter how much logic you throw back in their faces. Despite the fact that issues such as homelessness may never have gotten the attention it deserves without the upcoming Olympics the thought of actually working with VANOC to pursue common goals would never cross their puny minds.

Net-net is that they are doing far more harm to their cause than good. It's sad really.

[Jason0924]

Still taking applications for my Anti-APC group!

I had this idea to create an organization called CAMP (Citizens Against Militant Protesters) that would counter-protest these pin-heads at events. It died an early death when it became evident the only people who would join such a group have day jobs and a life on weekends.

Seriously though....where do I sign up?

[Kwik-E-Mart]

Violence is the foundation for extremism regardless of political spectrum (Marx with the class struggle and Hitler with the social darwinism). I'm not surprised at the antics of these protesters, but CSIS has to watch out for some taking pages from Al-Qaida as Olympics draws near.

[240glt]

I appreciate the responses but you are missing the point.

This isn't about greedy corporations or socialism. Spending for these (and past) games is on a steep uphill trajectory, and while yest corporate sponsorships offset a lot of the capital investments the operational costs, and a lot of the hidden costs are going to be bourne by the taxpayers.

In reality, the sky's the limit as far as how big & fantastic we could see future games. The question is; When does the spending (and don't be confused, an incredible amount of public funds are being funnelled into events like these with the *hopes* of dividends paying off after the party hats and streamers have been swept up and it's back to business as usual in the city.) for events like these trump what most people would normally consider to be normal taxpayer expenses ?

Really, this is a commentary on the olympics in general, not specifically Vancouver 2010. It's really great to see the beautiful new convention centre downtown, the village being built to replace former uban decay and the infrastructure projects like the Canada line and STS highway upgrades. I'll be checking all that out most likely as a former GS'er I'll probably be down there for 2010. However, It's totally foolish to expect that people who's priorities don't include all these nice things will simply be quiet as billions of public dollars are spent putting together what really constitutes a gift to civic elites, corporations and the well-heeled public who will be able to use the facilites after the 2010 dust has settled. Protesters need to convey their concerns in a way that doesn't alientate them and infuriate the general public, ANd the public needs to be ready for ligitimate questions from indiginous, anti-poverty and taxpayer groups when so much public funding is provided for events such as the summer & winter olympics.

[Jason0924]

Well said 240. I appreciate your comments about the Olympics overall and certainly my counter-point was more specific to Vancouver. I suppose like anything there's a right way to do things and a wrong way so as you said we'll have to wait for the dust to settle to see how Vancouver did.

I am however encouraged by the fact that VANOC has repeatedly stated they won't take the approach of previous games toward homeless. That being not to "gather them up" and temporarily shift them outside the city just prior to the games, but rather be part of the solution to help these people. They no doubt face an uphill battle with dozens of variables out of their control, but I commend them for facing it head-on. Like a previous poster said the shame of the DTES will hopefully motivate action. They're not going to be shipped off so the eyes of the world will be on us, and it's become evident this has created a sense of urgency.

The shame is the likes of the APC who claim to be the voice of the poor would much better serve the poor by finding ways to leverage this good will and actually work with those who share the same goals. Unfortunately for them they're too blinded by ideology and would consider this a deal with the devil. It really is short-sighted in my opinion.

[Coldrsx]

i am waiting for the sea to sky to be blocked around oh i dunno... squamish.

[Distill3d]

This isn't about greedy corporations or socialism. Spending for these (and past) games is on a steep uphill trajectory, and while yest corporate sponsorships offset a lot of the capital investments the operational costs, and a lot of the hidden costs are going to be bourne by the taxpayers.

In reality, the sky's the limit as far as how big & fantastic we could see future games. The question is; When does the spending (and don't be confused, an incredible amount of public funds are being funnelled into events like these with the *hopes* of dividends paying off after the party hats and streamers have been swept up and it's back to business as usual in the city.) for events like these trump what most people would normally consider to be normal taxpayer expenses?

anything that runs one dollar over what it was projected to cost when bids were originally made people are going to bitch and complain about. personally, i could care less if it costs $1 or $20 trillion to host these games. fact is, our region will once again be host and showcased to the world. the ends justify the means.

Really, this is a commentary on the olympics in general, not specifically Vancouver 2010. It's really great to see the beautiful new convention centre downtown, the village being built to replace former uban decay and the infrastructure projects like the Canada line and STS highway upgrades... However, It's totally foolish to expect that people who's priorities don't include all these nice things will simply be quiet as billions of public dollars are spent putting together what really constitutes a gift to civic elites, corporations and the well-heeled public who will be able to use the facilites after the 2010 dust has settled....

i whole heartedly agree with you. i will be using these facilities as much as the next guy. these are amazing and well needed additions to our city, especially the Canada Line.

you're right, the issue here is that the APC and protesters don't see that it is worth having. the city is actually attempting at doing something about its homelessness problem. really, these people are probably upset that no one like Bono or Bob Geldolf has come together and said we need to hold a Live Aid style concert and raise funds and awareness for them (at least thats my thinking). we have the right to protest, but there has to be a certain point when you are taking it too far.



this is the mission statement from the APC website:

The Anti-Poverty Committee is an organization of poor and working people, who fight for poor people, their rights and an end to poverty by any means necessary.

The poor face constant attack under the capitalist system and these attacks have only intensified under the BC Liberal government. APC is committed to fighting the brutal policies of the BC Liberals through direct action, mass mobilization, and casework.

We oppose racism, sexism, homophobia, and all other forms of oppression. APC is an independent and democratic organization open to anyone who agrees with our basis of unity. We are committed to working in solidarity with the struggles of other progressive movements — locally, nationally, and internationally — to end poverty and injustice.

they're basically saying "we will protest any cause you can throw at us, and this will not end with 2010". its good to know that some one is standing up for the homeless and those living in poverty, and i'm sure most of us are actually willing to listen so long as you are going to be peaceful about it getting your point across and use the proper channels.

[Jason0924]

Originally Posted by apc.resist.ca
The Anti-Poverty Committee is an organization of poor and working people, who fight for poor people, their rights and an end to poverty by any means necessary.

The poor face constant attack under the capitalist system and these attacks have only intensified under the BC Liberal government. APC is committed to fighting the brutal policies of the BC Liberals through direct action, mass mobilization, and casework.

We oppose racism, sexism, homophobia, and all other forms of oppression. APC is an independent and democratic organization open to anyone who agrees with our basis of unity. We are committed to working in solidarity with the struggles of other progressive movements — locally, nationally, and internationally — to end poverty and injustice.

I love how they say "democratic" and "open to anyone who agrees with us" in the same sentence.

If they're the self-proclaimed voice of the poor I feel even more sorry for the poor. In all honestly, as much as their antics are deplorable what really pisses me off is that there are organizations in Vancouver who are truly doing good work (United Way, Covenant House to name a few) to help the cause of the poor and homeless yet these jackasses are creating a distraction. Even worse, they have the dangerous potential to turn the average joe off the cause. So if a political party makes poverty their leading platform issue what's going to happen when John Q Public goes to the polls? What lingering thought is going to be in their minds? The thought of the poor homeless person who needs the resources to get a lift up in life, or the placard wielding wanker creating a barrier between children and olympic athletes?

[subdude]

Any protest that wants to be taken seriously should probably try to avoid having this person involved:

http://www.cpcml.ca/images2007/070926-VancouverBettyK-02.jpg

Her awesome contribution to the event (say it in your best screeching wicked-witch-of-the-west voice): "There's no spirit on that train!!!!"

[Distill3d]

I love how they say "democratic" and "open to anyone who agrees with us" in the same sentence.

If they're the self-proclaimed voice of the poor I feel even more sorry for the poor. In all honestly, as much as their antics are deplorable what really pisses me off is that there are organizations in Vancouver who are truly doing good work (United Way, Covenant House to name a few) to help the cause of the poor and homeless yet these jackasses are creating a distraction. Even worse, they have the dangerous potential to turn the average joe off the cause. So if a political party makes poverty their leading platform issue what's going to happen when John Q Public goes to the polls? What lingering thought is going to be in their minds? The thought of the poor homeless person who needs the resources to get a lift up in life, or the placard wielding wanker creating a barrier between children and olympic athletes?

:cheers:

well said

[mr.x]

When it comes to VANOC's Olympic expenditures, they're at $2-billion.

With VANOC's revenues, $760-million is being provided by domestic corporate sponsorships (i.e. $200-million from Bell or $100-million from both HBC and RBC). Another $400-million is coming from the IOC's The Olympic Partner sponsor program (i.e. Coca Cola, McDonalds) and the billions from tv rights. Corporate sponsorship alone for 2010 comes to more than $1.1-billion. $500-million will come ticketing, merchandising, licensing, etc.

Put all that together and VANOC's $1.6-billion operational costs are covered by private/non-public sources.

The public sector is only responsible for paying $580-million in capital/venue costs, a portion of the Olympic Village, a portion of the ceremonies costs, and a portion of the torch relay costs.

That's just for VANOC's costs.



When it comes to the billion dollar security cost, that of course is a public cost.....you could also add in the 2010 Own the Podium cost.....as well as the cost to run the provincial and federal Olympic secretariats. And I'm sure you all know that the city is dolling out millions for art displays, decorations, and Live Sites.



I'm not entirely sure how you could say that "massive public funding for facilities and infrastructure that ultimately benefits private companies the most is reaching dizzying perportions". For one thing, Vancouver's Olympic budget, even including hidden costs, are very modest compared to what Torino spent and what Sochi will spend.

The venues:
- Hillcrest curling centre will replace the existing and aging Riley Park Community Centre next door
- the Pacific Coliseum is getting needed upgrades in order for it to still be around for a few more decades
- BC Place is getting a much needed makeover that will extend its lifetime by decades
- the new rinks at UBC are a huge welcome, albeit there is one less rink than the old facility
- the oval in Richmond, will be turned into a community centre after the Games


As for things like:
- the Canada Line, would've been built regardless - we need it with or without 2010 - has been planned for decades
- the expanded convention centre - has been discussed for decades, not built just for the Olympics
- the Sea to Sky highway.....not a bad investment considering the tiny resort of Whistler is $1-billion of B.C.'s economy and 10% of the entire tourism economy

[city-dweller]

First, how many of you have protested publicly?
(just a wondering - not good/bad you have/haven't)

I am proud to live in a country where we have such freedoms. I attended a tuition protest once, and haven't bothered since because of the a**holes who make it so unsafe.
My issue w.r.t protesting comes from the so called 'professional protesters'. In my personal experience they are the most violent and abusive. They also are almost always the match the lights the keg. Its that line in the media "...and then it got ugly when someone...." guess who that someone was? Some of the well-known faces on the demonstration scene. They even high-jack other protests. I don't have the solutions, but the cops know who these guys are. If I throw a drink at a cop on the street, I would get arrested. No one would complain. Do the same at a 'protest' and its your right. Thats BS. Anyway....

[jlousa]

A Billion dollar security budget? Where did that number come from?
The official number is still set at $175Million, we know the real number will come in higher then that, but I would be very surprised if it reaches even $500Million, I would venture we'll be looking at $300-400Million.

[mr.x]

A Billion dollar security budget? Where did that number come from?
The official number is still set at $175Million, we know the real number will come in higher then that, but I would be very surprised if it reaches even $500Million, I would venture we'll be looking at $300-400Million.

The Italians spent $1-billion on Olympic security for 2006.....$1-billion is probably the worst case scenario for us, i'd venture somewhere between $500-million to a billion.

[WarrenC12]

One thing that we need to remember about the costs is the federal dollars we are getting. I don't know what that total is, but I'm sure that we wouldn't get a nickel out here if we weren't hosting "Canada's" Olympic Games. The sad fact is our tax money often goes to buy votes in Ontario and Quebec.

That's one of the things that pisses me off about the "healthcare not Olympics" crowd. As if there's a giant pool of money and we decided to buy 1 Olympics instead of 20 MRI machines. It just doesn't work that way.

[baggab]

Maybe they assume that since the government has money for a socialist boondoggle like the olypics they have money for social housing as well?

It's entirely true that these protests are incompatible with the format the games' organizers have constructed for display; what better weapon against protests do organizers have than to create a "family-friendly" space--one where protests are socially unacceptable because of their impacts on children? (Crying children = ironclad proof that THe Protseters ar evil!!1!). However, protest by nature must be unconstrained; who didn't scoff at the handful of parks where protesting was allowed in Beijing? (or think of the "free speech" cage in Arrested Development). The visceral reactions so many of you give to the protesters (let's call them "free speech in action") reveals the problem they represent: Southwest BC likes to claim the existence of (and its central role in) a "westcoast liberalism," but this breaks down with any threat to the more typical "wild-west" ideology that really monopolizes our discourse. It's no coincidence that The Province, a populist tabloid, will be the most one-sided and childish in its coverage of dissent.

There's no evidence that the protesters are on welfare, and even less that they play WOW (it's infinitely likely online forum-members play), so let's avoid talking about the people and focus on the act of protest and whether or not we recognize its importance.

So, what is it exactly that is preventing these people from getting housing if they are not on welfare?

I haven't had any of my friends have terrible trouble finding housing. They're from relatively poor families where they moved out from co-op housing and they would argue they don't "need" it. There are low rent basement units available too.

I don't really care about the Olympics, but everyone gets to decide where their tax dollars and money goes too and they've been out voted.

Despite Vancouver having high housing costs, rent isn't actually that bad. Unless you have to live in downtown or the westside.

[mooks28]

I really think we may be at the tipping point with this thing. Private citizens yelling at protestors does not a movement make.

[ReginaGuy]

i am waiting for the sea to sky to be blocked around oh i dunno... squamish.

Isn't it illegal to block driving lanes in a protest?

[Distill3d]

First, how many of you have protested publicly?
(just a wondering - not good/bad you have/haven't)

i've marched in and organized protests since i was a child. my parents always encouraged us (my sister and i) to stand up for what we believe in, and be heard in a peaceful manner. i've marched in several anti-war protests, and of course as an adolescent growing up in Alberta, we marched against Ralph Klien's budget cuts for education and health care spending.

i would never protest the Olympics based on the good it brings to humanity. we're using sport, rather than violence and weapons, to compete country against country. in fact, most wars take an Olympic cease fire during the games. the FIFA World Cup is much the same. for 2 weeks every 4 years, we take a break from trying to kill each other on the battle field to symbolically trying to kill each other on the sporting field. i have said that if the Olympics were held every year, there would be a reduction in the number of wars, and a larger number of nations competing against each other in a positive manner.

however, this isn't end the issues that groups like the APC are attempting to raise. i commend them for being the so called "voice of the poor". more does need to be done to combat homelessness, drug addiction, poverty, and the likes. more does need to be done to clean up the Downtown East Side. its just that the APC is going about this entirely wrong. vandalizing the Olympic clock, ruining the Olympic Spirit Train, and threatening to riot during the games is NOT an effective method of getting your point across. it does make them look like uneducated half wits with too much time on their hands.

not that VANOC has anything to do with the issues the APC is protesting, but does anyone know if VANOC has even sat down with the APC and explained things to them yet? or has the APC approached the civic, provincial, and federal government to sit down and discuss strategy?

and my final question then becomes, if we're able to lock up other terrorist cells before they strike, and these people are going as far as threatening violence, (the APC is claiming to "F**K The Olympic S**t Up!", as is clearly stated on their website), at what point do the RCMP or C-SIS step in and classify the APC as a terrorist group and lock them up for an indefinite period of time?

[Yume-sama]

Yes, the APC has approached the government. But... evidently they got a bit carried away and trashed their offices.

Their activities go from insane to borderline terrorism, there is no excuse for it. They don't want a debate, they want a "LOOK AT ME! DO AS I SAY!"

This poster says all you need to know about them. Anti-social "punks" who like cheap beer.

http://apc.resist.ca/graphics/iskra%20poster.jpg

[Jason0924]

not that VANOC has anything to do with the issues the APC is protesting, but does anyone know if VANOC has even sat down with the APC and explained things to them yet? or has the APC approached the civic, provincial, and federal government to sit down and discuss strategy?


Glad you asked. I know people who work for VANOC (if someone thinks that discredits me as being bias that's your problem) and I can tell you that NO, the APC has not sat down with VANOC. Why? Because the APC haven't asked. Sure they send posters to warn them that they'll be crashing events, but despite Garth Mullin's claim of wanting to be "part of the discussion" at no time have they officially requested a meeting for constructive dialogue. That's not what these people are interested in (I question whether they have the capacity for it). One group called the IOCC (Impact on Community Coalition) has met with Furlong and it was pointless. All they did was yell, and when Furlong attempted to respond they would cut him off and continue their diatribe. Needless to say he gave up, and the meeting was ultimately useless.

Again, they're not interested in constructive dialogue and finding common ground. They care only for their narrow-minded ideology. And I agree with you...this particular cause is just but their methods are nothing less than counter-productive.

[Jason0924]

First, how many of you have protested publicly?
(just a wondering - not good/bad you have/haven't)

I am proud to live in a country where we have such freedoms. I attended a tuition protest once, and haven't bothered since because of the a**holes who make it so unsafe.
My issue w.r.t protesting comes from the so called 'professional protesters'. In my personal experience they are the most violent and abusive. They also are almost always the match the lights the keg. Its that line in the media "...and then it got ugly when someone...." guess who that someone was? Some of the well-known faces on the demonstration scene. They even high-jack other protests. I don't have the solutions, but the cops know who these guys are. If I throw a drink at a cop on the street, I would get arrested. No one would complain. Do the same at a 'protest' and its your right. Thats BS. Anyway....

I attended the student tuition protests back in the mid-90's. I went to an anti-war rally once but refuse to again as I couldn't handle standing shoulder to shoulder with some of the a-holes holding signs like "9/11 was an inside job".