General Update/Rumour thread

[S-Man]

Domicile huh? Could be nice.

Wait, what I meant to express was outrage over three storey buildings in a predominately two storey neighbourhood. There go the property values!

[MountainView]

I read in Jan Harder's column that Domicile has purchased a swath of land near the intersection of Greenbank and Deerfox and is proposing to build a 154 multi-unit, stacked townhouse development with below-grade parking.

Interesting... just wondering was there a link to this because Greenbank and Deerfox don't meet each other, so I'm just trying to picture where this swath of land is. Thanks.

[Cre47]

Interesting... just wondering was there a link to this because Greenbank and Deerfox don't meet each other, so I'm just trying to picture where this swath of land is. Thanks.

Deerfox intersects with Woodroffe, and there isn't much space for that many units.

My thinking it is probably between the Via Tracks and Berrigan where there is quite a bit of land avilable, right along the new SW Transitway segment.

Unless it was in Half Moon Bay.

[McC]

The Cottage and a Kitchen on Parkdale between Lyndale and Burnside is closing at the end of the month, and the property's been sold to Richcraft. Not sure who owns the small apartment building and house on either side of the restaurant. A new development would probably only make sense if it covered half the block, i.e. included all three lots. The existing apartment buildings on either side are in the 6-storey range, and immediately behind are 3-storey mid-90s Claridge townhouses on Forward Ave.

It will be interesting to see what sort of scale they go for, and how deep they want to dig for Parking. SoHo Parkway was a very deep hole in solid bedrock, and the blasting caused some problems around the neighbourhood. I haven't heard whether there were issues among the townhouses and social housing immediately behind the hole on Forward Ave, but I know that the vibrations caused problems at those mid-90s Claridge townhouses I mentioned that are a block to the north on Forward, including a gas leak, which is pretty scary stuff really.

A footprint-maximizing slab or (or shorter shoe box) is likely, but it would be nice to see something with a podium and more graceful point tower (trading mass for height), not that I'll be holding my breath... Knowing Richcraft it'll be just a series drawings for decades anyway!

[Richard Eade]

Hmmph. I liked the Cottage and a Kitchen. I hope they open (yet again) somewhere else.

[McC]

Hmmph. I liked the Cottage and a Kitchen. I hope they open (yet again) somewhere else.

I don't think so, sounds like they're "retiring" (at least for now).

[Fraser]

Interesting... just wondering was there a link to this because Greenbank and Deerfox don't meet each other, so I'm just trying to picture where this swath of land is. Thanks.

Woops, sorry. I meant Woodroffe and Deerfox. It's the block of four homes that have been purchased.

Here's the link to the page on the City's website: http://app01.ottawa.ca/postingplans/appDetails.jsf?lang=en&appId=__8OLRO0.

The concept rendering provided is actually for L'Enclave Monfort. I guess these 2 projects will be awfully similar, if not identical.

[MountainView]

Thanks for the link... very interesting development for that area of Barrhaven as it is currently all single homes in that area. Looking at the site plan it looks like the only access to the southern parking lot will be from Woodroffe Ave Southbound only as it has a median dividing the lanes. So extra traffic for Deerfoot then. Although the 94 has a stop directly in front of this development which is very handy for transit riders.
I also had no idea that the 4 current houses there were for sale, I'm sure they sold for a decent chunk of cash then!

[Ottawan]

The Cottage and a Kitchen on Parkdale between Lyndale and Burnside is closing at the end of the month, and the property's been sold to Richcraft. Not sure who owns the small apartment building and house on either side of the restaurant. A new development would probably only make sense if it covered half the block, i.e. included all three lots. The existing apartment buildings on either side are in the 6-storey range, and immediately behind are 3-storey mid-90s Claridge townhouses on Forward Ave.

It will be interesting to see what sort of scale they go for, and how deep they want to dig for Parking. SoHo Parkway was a very deep hole in solid bedrock, and the blasting caused some problems around the neighbourhood. I haven't heard whether there were issues among the townhouses and social housing immediately behind the hole on Forward Ave, but I know that the vibrations caused problems at those mid-90s Claridge townhouses I mentioned that are a block to the north on Forward, including a gas leak, which is pretty scary stuff really.

A footprint-maximizing slab or (or shorter shoe box) is likely, but it would be nice to see something with a podium and more graceful point tower (trading mass for height), not that I'll be holding my breath... Knowing Richcraft it'll be just a series drawings for decades anyway!

The apartment building to the south is actually 7 stories, and that to the north 8 stories (not 6), and the Tunney's towers across the street are much taller. I'd be surprised (and disappointed) if they don't try for at least as tall as the Soho Parkway.

I agree with you that a podium with point tower would be the best design for this site. More importantly, I really hope there's some retail at ground - Parkdale is exactly the sort of street that could support this & needs a bit more life. It is a failing of Soho Parkway that it did not include any retail.

[rocketphish]

I read in Jan Harder's column that Domicile has purchased a swath of land near the intersection of Greenbank and Deerfox and is proposing to build a 154 multi-unit, stacked townhouse development with below-grade parking. <snip>

Deerfox. Pfft... what kind of a name is that anyway? Were Moosewolf and Dogcat already taken?

[McC]

The apartment building to the south is actually 7 stories, and that to the north 8 stories (not 6).

you're quite correct, I meant to say "6-8-storey range" (one number doesn't make for much of a range, does it?). In any event, word on the avenues is that Richcraft has acquired all three lots on Parkdale. Should we start the pool on which Parkdale site breaks ground first: Urbandale further north, this Richcraft, or Tega's would-be-funny-if-it-wasn't-so-scary proposal further south?

[TransitZilla]

Woops, sorry. I meant Woodroffe and Deerfox. It's the block of four homes that have been purchased.

Here's the link to the page on the City's website: http://app01.ottawa.ca/postingplans/appDetails.jsf?lang=en&appId=__8OLRO0.

The concept rendering provided is actually for L'Enclave Monfort. I guess these 2 projects will be awfully similar, if not identical.

I like the concept but the site plan makes it appear that all the entrances will be from the inside of the site, with the balconies overlooking the public streets. They should be flipped the other way around so there are actually doors on the street.

[Ottawan]

you're quite correct, I meant to say "6-8-storey range" (one number doesn't make for much of a range, does it?). In any event, word on the avenues is that Richcraft has acquired all three lots on Parkdale. Should we start the pool on which Parkdale site breaks ground first: Urbandale further north, this Richcraft, or Tega's would-be-funny-if-it-wasn't-so-scary proposal further south?

Not sure that I actually recall hearing about the Urbandale site - is there a thread or post about it?

I definitely think this Richcraft one will break ground long before the Tega dream (or nightmare). Something will eventually happen at Parkdale/Armstrong, but it won't be on this side of the decade.

[McC]

Not sure that I actually recall hearing about the Urbandale site - is there a thread or post about it?


I think it was just reported in a couple of posts here in the rumour thread earlier this year that Urbandale had bought the first three or four houses at the north end of Parkdale (it's all of the adjoining developable lots, I just don't remember whether there's three or four of them, they're mostly, if not all, boarded up now)

[wingman]

So, looks like the Zellers at the Gloucester Centre will become a Walmart... It is the only one owned by First Capital that will be changing - though there might be more in the area.

According to this (scroll to bottom of article):
http://www.menafn.com/qn_news_story.asp?storyid={fb9a417c-c3fe-4b27-95ba-395797919d8f}

[kevinbottawa]

So, looks like the Zellers at the Gloucester Centre will become a Walmart... It is the only one owned by First Capital that will be changing - though there might be more in the area.

According to this (scroll to bottom of article):
http://www.menafn.com/qn_news_story.asp?storyid={fb9a417c-c3fe-4b27-95ba-395797919d8f}

It looks like the Zellers on Sparks will be a Target as well.

http://www.obj.ca/Local/2011-09-23/article-2758453/Target-reveals-two-more-Ottawa-locations/1

[gjhall]

It looks like the Zellers on Sparks will be a Target as well.

http://www.obj.ca/Local/2011-09-23/article-2758453/Target-reveals-two-more-Ottawa-locations/1

Excellent news!

[TransitZilla]

It looks like the Zellers on Sparks will be a Target as well.

http://www.obj.ca/Local/2011-09-23/article-2758453/Target-reveals-two-more-Ottawa-locations/1

A Target on Sparks would be a great shot in the arm for that area.

... except the article also says the Gloucester Centre Zellers will be a Target, which contradicts the other link from the landlord that says it will be a Wal-Mart.

[gjhall]

A Target on Sparks would be a great shot in the arm for that area.

... except the article also says the Gloucester Centre Zellers will be a Target, which contradicts the other link from the landlord that says it will be a Wal-Mart.

Went to the source, and target's press release on its website confirms: Target at 156 Sparks!

http://pressroom.target.com/pr/news/target-finalizes-real-estate-transaction-215949.aspx

And they note that Sobey's will be providing the food distribution for Target, so this could see an interesting foray into downtown groceries...

[wingman]

A Target on Sparks would be a great shot in the arm for that area.

... except the article also says the Gloucester Centre Zellers will be a Target, which contradicts the other link from the landlord that says it will be a Wal-Mart.

Got to be careful with that, those leaseholds Target are taking over include 39 that are being sold to Walmart.

[rakerman]

new pavers down

http://farm7.static.flickr.com/6163/6181462887_2047f7f25d_z.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/rakerman/6181462887/)
DSC06158 (http://www.flickr.com/photos/rakerman/6181462887/) by rakerman (http://www.flickr.com/people/rakerman/), on Flickr

[Marcus CLS]

In the past week and today while cycling I noticed minor activity.

1. During the same walk I take every day from the O-Train early last week a for sale sign went up at the N.E. Corner of Carling and Preston. This site has been undergoing environmental clean up for the past two years. Major developement location. This won't take long to sell.

2. Today while cycling by, the proshine car wash at Wellington and Island Park had 6 noticable orange paint marks on the asphalt. Usually these mark future drill holes for soil testing. The site is for a proposed 7 sty. building status unknown.

3. Later today, the east half of the parking Lot at the S.W. corner of O'Conner and Nepean was closed off with a Drill truck and workers on site with several orange cones spread out marking various locations (working on a sunday?).

[McC]

2. Today while cycling by, the proshine car wash at Wellington and Island Park had 6 noticable orange paint marks on the asphalt. Usually these mark future drill holes for soil testing. The site is for a proposed 7 sty. building status unknown.
Redeveloping the Proshine lot didn't go much of anywhere last time; see, e.g., http://spacingottawa.ca/author/chrishenschel/

[waterloowarrior]

Local landlords and developers had less than two weeks to respond to the federal government's latest request for information for office space in the National Capital Region.

Public Works said it needs almost 285,000 square feet of office space – enough, it says, to house between 1,600 and 1,700 civil servants – to replace existing accommodations by 2015. The property must be close to a Transitway station, specifically those between the St. Laurent and Walkley stops. The Confederation O-Train station also qualifies.

http://www.obj.ca/Real%20Estate/Construction/2011-09-23/article-2757634/Terminal-Avenue-in-running-for-second-new-government-office/1

If the government acts on the current request for information and goes out to full tender, the leading development sites are likely to be:
• The VIA Rail property on Terminal Avenue, south of the station and tracks, which would be developed by Canderel;
• The Train Yards property, also in the Terminal Avenue area;
• St. Laurent Shopping Centre, which has redevelopment plans that include office components;
• Billings Bridge Shopping Centre, which has land available for development;
• The government-owned development site at the corner of St. Laurent Boulevard and Tremblay Road.

[waterloowarrior]

from http://www.bennettpros.com/

Distillery Lofts
Launching Fall 2011
http://bennettpros.com/myfiles/Distillery%20Lofts%20Logo%20comp.jpg

The Next
Launching Fall 2011
http://bennettpros.com/myfiles/The%20Next.jpg

[S-Man]

I can figure out the Central Park building, but where and what are the Distillery Lofts.......we have a distillery?

[amanfromnowhere]

an article from OBJ:

Developer says discussions with city show desire for intensification
Catherine Street, running parallel along the Queensway, is poised to turn into a gold mine for condo developers thanks to the city's intensification efforts, says one builder with a stake in the area.

Topics : Fortress Real Capital , Crerar Silverside , Lamb Development , Ottawa , Richmond Hill , Lyon
Richmond Hill, Ont.-based Fortress Real Capital has its eye on at least two more properties in the area of Bank and Catherine streets, in addition to its newly unveiled SoBa development, which will go up just south of the intersection. The 19-storey, nearly 250-unit tower scheduled for completion in 2014.

"The city has indicated they want to intensify that area," says Jawad Rathore, chief strategic officer at Fortress.

"They want to increase height in that area. We think it's going to be really revitalized, that part of Centretown."

Fortress and Lamb Development Corp. are working together on the SoBa project, with each chipping in capital costs. This is their second such agreement since starting work on the Gotham, a 17-storey, 240-unit building at the intersection of Lyon and Gloucester streets that will be finished in 2012.

The companies are part of an influx of Toronto developers eyeing Ottawa's condo market. Commonly cited factors for building in the national capital include the stabilizing presence of government, the number of young professionals looking to buy urban real estate, and older people seeking to downsize.

But the Bank and Catherine streets area in particular will be where Fortress expects to see the most growth, Mr. Rathore says.

"It's close to dining and restaurants, bars and shopping, close to where you want to be - and it has the added advantage of being a hip, cool address in a hot area."

The Greyhound station at Kent Street, just west of SoBa, is another site that could eventually sport residential condominium towers.

Last week, the city's planning committee endorsed a rezoning request by the property's owner - Crerar Silverside Corp. - that would allow for four buildings on the site, including two 25-storey towers containing retail, apartment and office space.

Vancouver-based Crerar wanted the property rezoned in case the operators of the intercity bus service opt to relocate the Ottawa facility. However, in an interview last year, the controlling shareholder of Crerar told OBJ he'd like it to continue to be a bus station as an income-generating property in the company's portfolio.

According to Mr. Rathore, discussions with the city during the summer indicated staff are looking at increasing the density allowances on Catherine Street, with towers ranging between 20 and 30 storeys. Past zoning restrictions for height made it too difficult to pursue for developers, he says.

"The city has mapped out that area for intensification, we're the first down there, and we're excited about that," he says. "The plan is for more."

FORTRESS AND LAMB'S DEVELOPMENTS IN OTTAWA

Gotham

Location: Lyon and Gloucester streets

Height: 17 storeys

No. of units: 240

Expected completion date: 2012



SoBa

Location: Bank and Catherine streets

Height: 19 storeys

No. of units: Up to 250

Expected completion date: 2014

[McC]

All of the parking and the low rise portion of the Staples (with or without the book store) is another lot ripe for re-development in that area.

[Uhuniau]

Close to the Transitway?

Too bad that condition wasn't applied to the disgusting RCMP move.

[Uhuniau]

I can figure out the Central Park building, but where and what are the Distillery Lofts.......we have a distillery?

This is Ottawa. You can't actually make any local references in the names of any local developments. It's a rule. They have be (pick one):

- references to New York, specifically Manhattan (the SOHOs, "Tribeca", "Central Park")
- imports from Toronto ("Distillery")
- vaguely London or English ("Notting Gate"), or Scottish (Glen This, This Glen)
- faux-frenchified, usually by adding "on the Parc"
- bizarrely nautical ("South Keys", "Barrhaven", "Old Barrhaven" for the love of frig; is there a "Kanata Wharf" yet?
- generic, sold by the strip to any developer in English-speaking North America ("Honeygables", "Bridlewood", "Centrepointe",
- just plain made up ("Morgan's Grant")

If your building or development is not named in accordance with one of these infallible rules, you are doing it wrong.

[OttawaSteve]

- just plain made up ("Morgan's Grant")

http://www.busgallery.ca/morgansgrant1.jpg

http://www.busgallery.ca/morgansgrant2.jpg

Sources: CCADP (http://digital.library.mcgill.ca/countyatlas/images/maps/townshipmaps/car-m-march.jpg) and the google.

[Umpaidh]

Barrhaven is names after Mel Barr. I'm not familiar with how that would relate to a nautical term.

I understand what you are saying about the recent condo's that all want to evoke NYC in their names, though.

[RTWAP]

Centrepointe is descriptive. Nepean was a spread out suburb with little intensification and realized that they should try to build a denser 'central' area. Hence the name, and moving city hall, the main library and the cultural centre there.

For the most part, the people who ran Nepean did a good job of setting ambitious long term goals and working toward them methodically.

[S-Man]

Hmmm...I recall a blog post by Ken Grey not too long ago warning of the dangers of an 'extremified' Centrepointe....not realizing that was always the intent....you know, with that whole school/mall/office/transit station thing going on.

A suitably logical argument would be: 'The shadows from the tall buildings will fall on the theatre and render the stages useless!'

[reidjr]

This is Ottawa. You can't actually make any local references in the names of any local developments. It's a rule. They have be (pick one):

- references to New York, specifically Manhattan (the SOHOs, "Tribeca", "Central Park")
- imports from Toronto ("Distillery")
- vaguely London or English ("Notting Gate"), or Scottish (Glen This, This Glen)
- faux-frenchified, usually by adding "on the Parc"
- bizarrely nautical ("South Keys", "Barrhaven", "Old Barrhaven" for the love of frig; is there a "Kanata Wharf" yet?
- generic, sold by the strip to any developer in English-speaking North America ("Honeygables", "Bridlewood", "Centrepointe",
- just plain made up ("Morgan's Grant")

If your building or development is not named in accordance with one of these infallible rules, you are doing it wrong.

To be fair its not just a ottawa issue they do this in toronto as well.

[amanfromnowhere]

From Jon Willing twitter
Construction fence up for Rink of Dreams at #OTTCity Hall. http://lockerz.com/s/142954099

[Uhuniau]

http://www.busgallery.ca/morgansgrant1.jpg

http://www.busgallery.ca/morgansgrant2.jpg

Sources: CCADP (http://digital.library.mcgill.ca/countyatlas/images/maps/townshipmaps/car-m-march.jpg) and the google.

And?

"Morgan's Grant" is still not a historical name. It was made up when the developer's marketer did the same thing you did, flip through the Atlas of the County of Carleton. It may as well have been "Bradley Estates" or "Armstrong Acres".

Nothing evokes the memory of a nineteenth-century plan of settlement like curlicue subdivisions, cul-de-sacs, and cookie-cutter houses.

[Uhuniau]

Barrhaven is names after Mel Barr. I'm not familiar with how that would relate to a nautical term.

Do you know what a "haven" is?

[Uhuniau]

Centrepointe is descriptive. Nepean was a spread out suburb with little intensification and realized that they should try to build a denser 'central' area. Hence the name, and moving city hall, the main library and the cultural centre there.

For the most part, the people who ran Nepean did a good job of setting ambitious long term goals and working toward them methodically.

That's almost funny!

Yeah, the municipality that bitched about its old downtown being annexed by Ottawa, and then spent decades allowing sprawl, sprawl, sprawl. "Centrepointe" wasn't, and still isn't, much of a centre, nor does it have much of a point!

It's also a bland, generic name that recurs in a number of other English-speaking North American cities.

[OttawaSteve]

And?

And:

- George Morgan was not some random landowner, but one of the half dozen or so original (c. 1820) settlers of March Township (and, for a time, the township Treasurer)

- the original Morgan's Grant subdivision was built encircling Morgan's Grant Woods (slightly off-topic: a designated urban natural area of "exceptional natural diversity" (report (http://www.ottawa.ca/calendar/ottawa/citycouncil/occ/2005/06-08/pec/Final%20Report_UNAEES.htm))). These woods are in fact located right in the middle of one of George Morgan's land grants, but I was unable to determine whether the name of the woods pre-dates the subdivision (anyone know?)

- purely incidentally, it's neat that some of the original forced road network for this immediate area has been retained, namely the Goulbourn Road (now Flamborough Way).

All of this is, of course, neither here nor there.

The bigger question concerns this desire to draw a firm distinction between legitimate "historical names" and categorically "not...historical" labels that have been "just plain made up" by developers' marketing teams. But I wonder if this is even a plausible distinction, given 1) the history of the way names have been assigned to places in North America, and the rationale; and 2) the arbitrariness of the criteria by which we decide to define the continuity of places, people, and cultures over time.

[Uhuniau]

And:

- George Morgan was not some random landowner, but one of the half dozen or so original (c. 1820) settlers of March Township (and, for a time, the township Treasurer)

None of which detracts from my basic point: "Morgan's Grant" is a recent fabrication, which could easily have been [OTHER NAME]'s [OTHER GENERIC]. It's not a long-standing cultural feature, in the topographical sense of the term.

- purely incidentally, it's neat that some of the original forced road network for this immediate area has been retained, namely the Goulbourn Road (now Flamborough Way).

Too bad it didn't retain that name. That's the kind of historical continuity I like.

The bigger question concerns this desire to draw a firm distinction between legitimate "historical names" and categorically "not...historical" labels that have been "just plain made up" by developers' marketing teams. But I wonder if this is even a plausible distinction, given 1) the history of the way names have been assigned to places in North America, and the rationale; and 2) the arbitrariness of the criteria by which we decide to define the continuity of places, people, and cultures over time.

I would really like to see the power of developers to just give places crappy, cheesy, tacky names, taken away from them, along with their power to draw crappy, cheesy, permanently inefficient street layouts.

You want to develop an area? Give it a nice marketing name? Sure - now, here is the list of locally-relevant geographical features or historical references which you will pick from when naming your subdivision.

Happy sales!

[citizen j]

Cheesy, random, generic, and/or non-place-specific development names? "Heart's Desire" anyone? I believe it's down on Prince of Wales. Other favourites include Mahogany, Arcadia, Avalon, and Parkwood Hills (which sounded so much better than Hillswood Park). And yes, I agree, it would have been preferable to have left Goulbourn Forced Road's name untouched at the north end rather than rename it Flamborough, but then again, perhaps better to call it something more South-Central Ontario-ish (Halton Terrace?) than keep local history in place. I'm sure it sold more homes for Minto. Goulbourn probably would have scared off potential buyers with its Hallowe'en overtones.

[Umpaidh]

Do you know what a "haven" is?

A place of safety or refuge, to take the words right out of the dictionary.

Out of curiosity, what are some good names of suburbs used in the past 30-40 years that you can think of?

[lrt's friend]

Cheesy, random, generic, and/or non-place-specific development names? "Heart's Desire" anyone? I believe it's down on Prince of Wales. Other favourites include Mahogany, Arcadia, Avalon, and Parkwood Hills (which sounded so much better than Hillswood Park). And yes, I agree, it would have been preferable to have left Goulbourn Forced Road's name untouched at the north end rather than rename it Flamborough, but then again, perhaps better to call it something more South-Central Ontario-ish (Halton Terrace?) than keep local history in place. I'm sure it sold more homes for Minto. Goulbourn probably would have scared off potential buyers with its Hallowe'en overtones.

I really don't understand this criticism of community names. Of course, there will be a marketing component. Of course, not all will have a historical context. When names were assigned even in the old days, they didn't always have a historical context. In many cases, there was no history when the names were created. They may be a reminder of somewhere else, of the homeland, of something dreamed for the better in the future, or the desired name was changed because of limitations placed on the people when a Post Office was established. I am all for honouring our history but some communities are so small that you cannot come up with enough names that are both relevant historically and attractive from a marketing perspective.

I really don't know the history behind Heart's Desire but this is not a new name. It dates back a number of decades at least. I know there are manuscripts floating around concerning local place names that may help identify the origins of some of these names. Prince of Wales Drive, being an old road has a number of old place names associated with it. Rideau View, Rideau Heights, Victory Hill and Heart's Desire are a few of them.

When you think about it, what about a name like Alta Vista? Does it have a historical context? Probably not. It is, however, a descriptive name relevant to the location and used for marketing back in the pre-world war I land boom when the original Alta Vista was first subdivided. Marketing was important even back then.

[citizen j]

I really don't understand this criticism of community names. Of course, there will be a marketing component. Of course, not all will have a historical context. When names were assigned even in the old days, they didn't always have a historical context. In many cases, there was no history when the names were created. They may be a reminder of somewhere else, of the homeland, of something dreamed for the better in the future, or the desired name was changed because of limitations placed on the people when a Post Office was established. I am all for honouring our history but some communities are so small that you cannot come up with enough names that are both relevant historically and attractive from a marketing perspective.

I really don't know the history behind Heart's Desire but this is not a new name. It dates back a number of decades at least. I know there are manuscripts floating around concerning local place names that may help identify the origins of some of these names. Prince of Wales Drive, being an old road has a number of old place names associated with it. Rideau View, Rideau Heights, Victory Hill and Heart's Desire are a few of them.

When you think about it, what about a name like Alta Vista? Does it have a historical context? Probably not. It is, however, a descriptive name relevant to the location and used for marketing back in the pre-world war I land boom when the original Alta Vista was first subdivided. Marketing was important even back then.

Basically, it's a question of relevance and connection. So, reference to local history, local geography, or community names with a reference to an older community/home seem to make sense. New Edinburgh, Billings Bridge, the Glebe, Sandy Hill, Lower Town, Beacon Hill, Bells Corners, etc. make sense to varying degrees. Even the specious Morgan's Grant (east-end equivalent might be something like Convent Glen) at least throws a bone to the area's past. Like you, I did think about Alta Vista. There is a rise from which there is something of a view, so it's quite a stretch. Plus, the syntax is wrong -- it should be Vista Alta. I guess the criticism is that with so many possible choices that actually commemorate/preserve the history of the place -- and it doesn't have to be limited to European history -- things like Mahogany and Arcadia seem like the product of test-market paperwork and a lost opportunity.

[ServiceGuy]

I've heard though the construction grapevine that a developer other than Claridge has manged to finally aquire the Dworkin Furs property. As soon as I get confirmation and info on who it is I'll post it here. This is the rumour thread right? ;)

[McC]

I've heard though the construction grapevine that a developer other than Claridge has manged to finally aquire the Dworkin Furs property. As soon as I get confirmation and info on who it is I'll post it here. This is the rumour thread right? ;)

Dang, I was really looking forward to Claridge Plaza VII and VIII, that's the one when they finally find their groove!

[S-Man]

From something I heard many months ago (in passing), I believe it's Phoenix.

Phoenix Plaza Phases I and II :jester:

[ServiceGuy]

Well if it's Phoenix it will be limited to 6 floors. I'll do some serious snooping next week and let you know what I find out.

[Uhuniau]

Plus, the syntax is wrong -- it should be Vista Alta.

Depends on whether your going for northern or southern Italian.... :)

[blackjagger]

Well if it's Phoenix it will be limited to 6 floors. I'll do some serious snooping next week and let you know what I find out.

There was talk a couple months ago that the investor group that financed the new rental building at the General was looking to build one around King Edward and Rideau. Phoenix handled the development of that project and gave the construction to Broccolini. If its part rental it could be coming out of the ground much faster.

Food for thought.

Cheers,
Josh

[waterloowarrior]

Don't worry, Claridge is still active in the area :[ Looks like they've picked up the Honest Lawyer

http://www.juteaujohnsoncomba.com/ms_august2011.htm

Claridge Homes also closed on 141 George Street. The property was transferred from Donley Investments Ltd. to Claridge Homes (George St) Inc. for $3,175,000 or $291/sf. The property is currently leased to a restaurant for another two years


back in 2001
http://www.juteaujohnsoncomba.com/ms_november2001.htm

A one-storey restaurant/bar at 141 George Street in the ByWard Market was sold by Connie Salomon to Donley Investments Limited for $885,500 or $86/sq.ft.

[waterloowarrior]

one of the nearby parking lots near the Honest Lawyer was for sale back in '09... wonder if Claridge bought that one too

the latest episode of big city broker has Brad Lamb looking at some properties in Ottawa. He looked at a site near Gloucestor and Metcalfe, a parking lot beside Capital Music Hall, and a site at Lisgar between Bank and O'Connor. He made an offer on the Lisgar site, but it didn't work out after a land swap fell through

[waterloowarrior]

Not sure if this is posted yet, but there is a Broccolini construction site behind the General Hospital google map (http://maps.google.ca/?ie=UTF8&ll=45.403105,-75.643229&spn=0,0.009602&z=17&layer=c&cbll=45.403437,-75.642815&panoid=eVExpmfkXVM0JIDuRNMUKg&cbp=12,250.61,,0,6.31).

Life Sciences Condo (http://www.broccolini.com/Broccolini_Project_Detail.aspx?ProjectID=177&All=No&Green=No&Current=Yes)



Seems to be an odd location for a 12 story condo - surrounded by hospital and parking lots.


Haven't been by the site, but I've seen some ads saying Occupancy Oct 1st...

http://www.lavantagesuites.ca/

[amanfromnowhere]

From DCN:

Westboro Collection, Parcel 3, 319 McRae Ave, K1Z 8L8
$60,000,000 est
Note: Project is preliminary. Scope of work has not been finalized pending the re-zoning approval. Design, tender and construction will be determined once re-zoning approval has been in place. Parcel 1 can be followed under ID# 9145009 and parcel 2 can be followed under ID# 9145012. Further update spring, 2012.
Project: proposed construction of a six-storey building with retail at-grade, office on the second floor and condominium apartments on the remaining floors transitioning to four-storey stacked townhouses.
Scope: 55,316 m²; 6 storeys
Development: New
Category: Apartment bldgs; Commercial offices; Retail, wholesale services

source (http://www.dcnonl.com/cgi-bin/top10.pl?rm=show_top10_project&id=b1ea923f5ffe730c78a0054f4cbc1bffed3c1898&projectid=9145017&region=ontario)

[amanfromnowhere]

From DCN:

Westboro Collection, Parcel 1, 1976 Scott St, Scott St and Tweedsmuir Avenue, K1Z 1E6
$35,000,000 est
Note: Project is preliminary. Scope of work has not been finalized pending the re-zoning approval. Design, tender and construction will be determined once re-zoning approval has been in place. Parcel 2 can be followed under ID# 9145012 and parcel 3 can be followed under ID# 9145017. Further update spring, 2012.
Project: proposed construction of a new 12-storey apartment building on northeast portion of site and six-storey building on northwest portion with at-grade retail.
Scope: 31,993 m²; 12 storeys
Development: New
Category: Apartment bldgs; Retail, wholesale services

source (http://www.dcnonl.com/cgi-bin/top10.pl?rm=show_top10_project&id=5776c3e67dab551c66a43ce2bedf8222b3219a94&projectid=9145009&region=ontariohttp://)

[Ottawan]

Don't worry, Claridge is still active in the area :[ Looks like they've picked up the Honest Lawyer

http://www.juteaujohnsoncomba.com/ms_august2011.htm

Claridge Homes also closed on 141 George Street. The property was transferred from Donley Investments Ltd. to Claridge Homes (George St) Inc. for $3,175,000 or $291/sf. The property is currently leased to a restaurant for another two years


back in 2001
http://www.juteaujohnsoncomba.com/ms_november2001.htm

A one-storey restaurant/bar at 141 George Street in the ByWard Market was sold by Connie Salomon to Donley Investments Limited for $885,500 or $86/sq.ft.

358% return on investment over 10 years (pessimistically assuming rental income and property management costs cancel each other out). Not bad at all.

[kevinbottawa]

Here's a nice video of Toronto's Tall Buildings strategy. Do we have anything like this in Ottawa?

http://youtu.be/3MOQi-77iW4

[amanfromnowhere]

Here's a nice video of Toronto's Tall Buildings strategy. Do we have anything like this in Ottawa?

http://youtu.be/3MOQi-77iW4

We have a draft version of Centretown Community Design Plan:
http://ottawa.ca/residents/public_consult/mid_centretown_cdp/draft_cdp_en.html
chapters 3 and 6...

[ThaLoveDocta]

Well it would seem Halifax (GMA: 2006 pop:372,858) seems to have beat Ottawa (GMA: 2006 pop:1,130,761) to the punch with a proposal like this...


United Gulf to build 48-storey towers in Halifax

PATRICIA WILLIAMS (staff writer)

United Gulf Developments Ltd. has unveiled plans for a $350 million, mixed-use project in Halifax, Nova Scotia, designed to reflect the city’s sea-faring traditions and rich maritime history.

The two, 48-storey towers resemble a ship’s twin sails, “that push the seafarer toward the horizon,” says president Navid Saberi.

He said the unique architecture will enhance the city’s reputation as a city of contrasts — one that celebrates its past while embracing its future on the world stage.

Designed by Toronto-based architectsAlliance, the Skye Halifax will house condominiums that are “especially sensitive” to the needs and expectations of the burgeoning Echo Boomer market. Units will be designed to accommodate families, couples and individuals.

The development will include a boutique hotel at the podium level. Retail facilities and restaurants are also proposed. Some 350 to 400 below-grade parking spaces will be provided.

LEED certification will be sought.

Green features include geothermal heating and cooling, green roof terraces, grey-water systems, low-flow plumbing fixtures and elements and non-reflective glass.

Secured indoor and outdoor bicycle storage facilities will be provided. Shower stalls will be installed for the use of commercial and retail tenants who commute to the city by bike.

Patrick LeRoy, United Gulf’s vice-president of operations, said conceptual design has been completed.

Construction is scheduled to get underway before the end of next year.

United Gulf is currently negotiating with three general contractors to construct the project.

“We will employ a construction management team on site to make sure the project is delivered on time and within budget,” LeRoy said.

From a construction perspective, LeRoy said challenges could include recruiting some of the specialized workforce “that will be needed to build a project of this magnitude.

“The project design is well considered and we do not expect any major complications in this area.”

Halifax-based United Gulf has been in business since 1994.
http://www.dcnonl.com/article/id47070/--united-gulf-to-build-48-storey-towers-in-halifax

http://www.dcnonl.com/images/archivesid/47070/140.jpg
Image Credit: DCN

[S-Man]

It won't get built. Halifax has just as many NIMBYs per capita and as dysfunctional a city council as Ottawa.

[Harley613]

What Ottawa needs is a new Robert Campeau...a developer who believes in logical density and and has vision and isn't afraid of the old guard. I think things will change soon. The baby boomers are getting old and they seem to be the predominant generation of NIMBY's, and they are on every street and in almost every seat in city council. I feel the next generation of politicians and prominent residents will be far more accommodating to a new vision for Ottawa, one that matches the city in size and still respects the fact that it is the Capital. I don't think any of us on here who criticize the NIMBYs and the height restrictions want to destroy the damned sightlines to parliament hill. It's the rest of the city we're fighting for. When a developer is too scared to propose a building over 27 stories ANYWHERE in the core we have a problem. Time and patience, let's see what happens in five years!

[Ottawan]

What Ottawa needs is a new Robert Campeau...a developer who believes in logical density and and has vision and isn't afraid of the old guard. I think things will change soon. The baby boomers are getting old and they seem to be the predominant generation of NIMBY's, and they are on every street and in almost every seat in city council. I feel the next generation of politicians and prominent residents will be far more accommodating to a new vision for Ottawa, one that matches the city in size and still respects the fact that it is the Capital.

I wouldn't paint all boomers with the same brush, but by and large I agree. I think that Ottawa-Gatineau has been growing at a very consistent rate for a very long period of time (especially compared to other cities in Canada) and that much of the older population (I would include with the Boomers, while we're generalizing, the current seniors and sadly the Gen Xers as well) hasn't yet come to terms with the fact that we are a first-tier city in Canada, not a second-tier city.

Vancouver is less than double our size, not many multiples our size, and Montreal is now less than three times our size. We are at the core of our own regional hinterland which we service (we are "the City" to Eastern Ontario and Western Quebec, and also to a lesser degree the urban centre that services Northern Ontario & Nunavut). We are a city of almost a million with a metro region of almost 1.5 million - the up and coming generations seem to be much more urban, and cognescent of this fact.

I don't think any of us on here who criticize the NIMBYs and the height restrictions want to destroy the damned sightlines to parliament hill. It's the rest of the city we're fighting for. When a developer is too scared to propose a building over 27 stories ANYWHERE in the core we have a problem. Time and patience, let's see what happens in five years!

Exactly! Maybe there's good reason for the next phase of Place de Ville to be no higher than any of the others, but why can't we have some nice towers with real & significant height in Little Italy, Tunney's Pasture, Hurdman, Confederation Heights, the undeveloped part of Carleton U Campus, Vanier at the Parkway & Montreal Road, CFB Rockliffe, or other similar locations?

[kevinbottawa]

...we are a first-tier city in Canada, not a second-tier city...We are at the core of our own regional hinterland which we service (we are "the City" to Eastern Ontario and Western Quebec, and also to a lesser degree the urban centre that services Northern Ontario & Nunavut). We are a city of almost a million with a metro region of almost 1.5 million...why can't we have some nice towers with real & significant height in Little Italy, Tunney's Pasture, Hurdman, Confederation Heights, the undeveloped part of Carleton U Campus, Vanier at the Parkway & Montreal Road, CFB Rockliffe, or other similar locations?

I love these points. Well said!

[McC]

What Ottawa needs is a new Robert Campeau...a developer who believes in logical density and and has vision and isn't afraid of the old guard.
You do know that Campeau was building cookie cutter houses in the suburbs at the same time, right? they were all made out of ticky tacky and they all look just the same.

[S-Man]

They're all valid points, though I would hesitate to put Little Italy in the same development potential zone as those other locations. But yes, there are so many places where height wouldn't bother people due to a large buffer distance, but as the NIMBYs have taught us repeatedly the last decade or so, just the IDEA and thought of a tall building - anywhere - is enough for a public outcry.
Pointing out how the city is growing and economic factors will just be met with 'quality of life' and the usual complaints. It's a brick wall. People who got used to all development occurring out of sight in the suburbs from the 60s to now aren't going to see things differently and change their tune.

The Greber Plan and the 'outwards, never upwards' car-centric planning of the last half of the 20th century is so ingrained in some people (like Ken Grey and his zombie ilk) that expecting them to realize things have to change is impossible. And it is predominately the boomers.
I've been to numerous meetings of this type, and if there are 100 people in the room, at least 80 to 90 of them are aged 45 to 70. And they're angry - not sure why, not sure at who or for what reason, but they sit there, red in the face, almost unable to contain themselves...and they don't even live on the same street as the proposed (often low-rise) development.

A psychology prof would have a field day trying to figure out this strange 'allergic to all things urban...or any type of change' syndrome. Too often I hear people say "we don't need light rail - we're not a big city (or specifically, Toronto)"
Same goes for tall buildings, even bars and sports teams (!).

Their argument is always "what are we trying to prove - that we're a big city?", to which I reply: Yes, we are!
This desperately-clinging-to-small-town mentality reeks of fear of change and does no service to the million-plus people who need to get around the city without cars (!), get to work, and pay for constantly-reduced services. What was the population of Toronto in the '50s when the first light rail line was built? Probably less than what we are now. Edmonton has less population, but already has light rail.

I don't see how problems of density, transit, sprawl and tax revenue don't apply to Ottawa on the grounds of 'we're Ottawa'. It makes no sense.

The population and geographical expanse of the city's urban area has grown by so much a change is needed. Given the limited capacity of our downtown streets and the state of our bus system, LRT is needed as it is currently planned (only implemented faster). Cancelling it and starting over in the hopes it can be built faster and cheaper in the future is pointless. It is needed now. The lands north of the transitway to the river west of downtown, plus city centre and Bayview yards, could accommodate a huge number of people, and would be served by this line as soon as phase 1 opens.

Sorry, it's just exasperating to have people advocate for more sprawl and more cars on the road to protect their mental bubble of living in a small town.

[S-Man]

Note: this will be last rant regarding this scenario which apparently never happens. October has just become self-control month for me!;)

[amanfromnowhere]

small step in right direction...
From OpenFile Ottawa:

It looks like the William Street Pedestrian Square will become permanent in April 2012.
http://ottawa.openfile.ca/blog/curator-blog/breaking/2011/byward-pedestrian-area-should-become-permanent-2012

[acottawa]

...When a developer is too scared to propose a building over 27 stories ANYWHERE in the core we have a problem. Time and patience, let's see what happens in five years!

I realize this is a forum for skyscraper fans, but I wonder how much demand really exists for taller buildings in Ottawa. Claridge puts up about one 20+ story building a year, all of the other developers combined probably average 1-2 per year (despite a decade-long real estate boom). Downtown Ottawa seems to have about 5 approved office buildings without shovels in the ground. Ottawa has zero HQs of large companies who might want a marquee building, and I doubt the government is going to be in the skyscraper business.

I'm sure if there were fewer restrictions then some of those 25 storey buildings would be a little higher, but I really doubt there is a lineup of developers being held back by zoning laws (as opposed to economic considerations).

[LeadingEdgeBoomer]

Harley613

The baby boomers are getting old and they seem to be the predominant generation of NIMBY's, and they are on every street and in almost every seat in city council.

Just for the record--I am a baby boomer--a leading edge baby boomer to be exact ( that means born in the first cohort of BBs)

I DO favour intensfication, taller buildings here and there, improved transit--light rail and a GO type train for the valley, CFL and pro soccer at LP with the city/OSEG partnership---more concerts , arts, and entertainment in Ottawa--more noise because we are living in a bigger city now and noise comes with the territory. :cool:

If I did not want the amenties, and the noise of a big city, I would move to a retirement home in Elliot Lake, as some retirees have.

A more vibrant Ottawa--BRING IT ON!

Yours truly.
LeadingEdgeBoomer

P.S--I get my first OAS payment in December--Yeah! :D

[reidjr]

I realize this is a forum for skyscraper fans, but I wonder how much demand really exists for taller buildings in Ottawa. Claridge puts up about one 20+ story building a year, all of the other developers combined probably average 1-2 per year (despite a decade-long real estate boom). Downtown Ottawa seems to have about 5 approved office buildings without shovels in the ground. Ottawa has zero HQs of large companies who might want a marquee building, and I doubt the government is going to be in the skyscraper business.

I'm sure if there were fewer restrictions then some of those 25 storey buildings would be a little higher, but I really doubt there is a lineup of developers being held back by zoning laws (as opposed to economic considerations).

There are some hq of fair size companys plus there are some up and comming companys that could be very big in the next 5-10 years plus ottawa is home to a fair amount of medium size head quarters..

[Jamaican-Phoenix]

There are some hq of fair size companys plus there are some up and comming companys that could be very big in the next 5-10 years plus ottawa is home to a fair amount of medium size head quarters..

Not to mention regional headquarters. Ottawa is "The City" for most people in eastern Ontario and parts of southwestern Quebec.

[S-Man]

LeadingEdgeBoomer: Right on! With cities come needs for transit and entertainment close at hand; not hard to understand, but....

[amanfromnowhere]

Does anybody know what this application is for:

http://app01.ottawa.ca/postingplans/appDetails.jsf?lang=en&appId=__8UW8OR

SoBa?

[amanfromnowhere]

Does anybody know what this application is for:

http://app01.ottawa.ca/postingplans/appDetails.jsf?lang=en&appId=__8UW8OR

SoBa?

ok, found.... thanks google:
SoBa Condominiums, Bank Street and 203 Catherine Street, Ottawa Ontario (http://www.condoforsaletoronto.ca/Soba-bank-catherine-street-ottawa-brad-lamb-real-estate-condominiums-pre-construction.html)

[phil235]

Harley613

.

Just for the record--I am a baby boomer--a leading edge baby boomer to be exact ( that means born in the first cohort of BBs)

I DO favour intensfication, taller buildings here and there, improved transit--light rail and a GO type train for the valley, CFL and pro soccer at LP with the city/OSEG partnership---more concerts , arts, and entertainment in Ottawa--more noise because we are living in a bigger city now and noise comes with the territory. :cool:

If I did not want the amenties, and the noise of a big city, I would move to a retirement home in Elliot Lake, as some retirees have.

A more vibrant Ottawa--BRING IT ON!

Yours truly.
LeadingEdgeBoomer

P.S--I get my first OAS payment in December--Yeah! :D


Those comments are awesome. As tempting as it is after watching the "Friends" in action, we do need to be careful not to paint an entire group with the same brush.

[McC]

we do need to be careful not to paint an entire group with the same brush.

imagine that

[amanfromnowhere]

Another article about Catherine Street intensification:

Condos could choke out affordable housing, groups say
Friday, 14 October 2011
By Marcus Guido

Published in : Centretown News, News

Before a possible boom in condominium development on Catherine Street, some Centretown organizations are questioning the effect too many new buildings may have on neighbourhood housing.

In addition to the newly revealed, 19-storey SoBa condominium on Catherine Street set for completion in 2014, Fortress Real Capital and Lamb Development Corp. are working together to build the Gotham condo at Lyon and Gloucester streets, which should be finished next year.

The Toronto-area companies have also expressed interest in two more properties in SoBa’s area, but have not released details.

This summer, the city indicated plans to intensify Catherine Street and the surrounding area by allowing the development of 20 to 30-storey buildings, says Jawad Rathore, Fortress Real Capital’s chief strategic officer.

The SoBa building will help revitalize Catherine Street, he says.

“With more people living there, there’s going to be more reason for the area to be busy at night and not just during work hours,” says Rathore. “It’s not too far from downtown and not too far from the Glebe. It’s a winner that people are going to love.”

He isn’t the only one who says he looks forward to seeing more condos in Centretown.

“More residents mean a larger market for businesses, which then move in to service the larger population, contributing to the (area’s) revitalization,” says Jordan Charbonneau, acting president of the Centretown Citizens Community Association.

The development of more condos is an example of how cities are evolving to accommodate people who want to be part of densely-populated communities, he says.

But condos shouldn’t be the only housing options in the neighbourhood, he adds.

“Giving people choice is a good thing,” he says. “So by having rental units, condos and fully detached housing in our community, all Centretowners benefit.”

Another local organization says it’s worried there could eventually be a lack of affordable housing options.

“There certainly needs to be some way of preserving a balance between rental apartments and condos,” says Raymond Sullivan, executive director of housing for the Centretown Citizens Ottawa Corporation.

The corporation is the driving force behind the Beaver Barracks – an affordable rental housing project on Metcalfe Street and Argyle Avenue.

Completion of three more buildings, including one on Catherine Street, is expected next spring.

With more land being dedicated to condominium projects, less can be used to build inexpensive housing, says Sullivan.

“Even if some condos are modestly priced, coming up with a down payment, or getting a mortgage from a bank, can be an obstacle for a lot of low-income households,” he argues.

And since most condos are made up of bachelor and one-bedroom units, he adds, they are of no use to families in need of a home.

http://centretownnewsonline.ca/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=2614&Itemid=94

[amanfromnowhere]

This one is from cbc:

Condo construction, sales boom in Ottawa
Ottawa residents need only crane their necks up to see the city is in the midst of a condominium boom but at least one city planner says while condos are booming, new rental buildings are virtually non-existent.
New condo projects are breaking ground, going up and selling out not only in centretown but also in neighbourhoods like Westboro, Little Italy and New Edinburgh.

Stanley Wilder, the city's housing policy planner, put together a map of development for a period covering 2003-08 on the city's website.

Since then, he said many of the projects in development at the time have sold out and some are expanding.

"570 Laurier West, 120 units, those are gone, sold out," said Wilder, ticking off the list. "412 Nepean, 33 units, gone, sold...445 Laurier West...105 units sold and now re-selling."

About 20 of the 30-odd developments from that older list have been built and sold out, said Wilder, and that does not include many developments that have sprouted up since, including projects by developers like Mastercraft Starwood, Domicile and Urbandale.

Downtown Ottawa is undergoing intensification with the influx of new condominiums being built or already standing. (CBC)
Ottawa's downtown core undergoing intensification
Carleton architecture professor Benjamin Gianni said the intensification in the city's core has been surprising and mostly encouraging.

"Every time I see a crane go up I think that has to be the absolute last one, then I find four more the next, ten more the next year," said Gianni.

Ottawa's self-styled condo queen, Marnie Bennett, who says she has sold more than 3,000 condo units in the past three years, says there is a shift in the market as people line up to buy.

"It's a storm," said Bennett at a cocktail soiree she hosted for some 400 clients. "Everyone is looking for that housing style it's great...in Westboro condo development is going crazy, so you can see it spreading. People are looking to live in condos."

The Cathedral Hill condo development at Sparks and Bay is one of the new kids on the block. It only took a weekend for buyers to scoop up 70 per cent of the units on offer.

Different motivations to scooping up new condos
First-time condo buyer Hal Pruden said he is moving in because it is close to work and offers him a low maintenance lifestyle.

"I didn't want to be shovelling snow in winter and raking leaves in the fall," said Pruden.

While people looking to move closer to downtown are moving into condos, these aren't necessarily the same people who are buying the condominium units.

'Every time I see a crane go up I think that has to be the absolute last one, then I find four more the next, ten more the next year.'
—Benjamin Gianni, architecture professorMany of the people CBC spoke with at Bennett's party said they were buying to rent out and considered the properties investments they considered safe given volatility in the stock market.

"In the last two years I've seen that the average annual increase in my [ten] properties has been about $20,000 per unit," said Bruce Dwyer.

"In two years that $200,000 in equity growth, so that's pretty significant when you are talking a couple million dollars in real estate. That's a ten per cent gain on your investment over a two-year period. Where did we get that in the mutual fund market?"

Rental buildings are going extinct
The growth in condominium development, however, has not been matched by similar rental developments. Stanley Wilder said while the number of condos went up in the last year, not a single rental building was constructed.

"It's more attractive for a condominium developer to build a condominium, sell it and walk away," said Wilder.

The significant downside to this is that condominium units can be expensive to rent.

"At the present time its difficult to find rental property that's affordable and a person would want to live in," said Wilder.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/ottawa/story/2011/10/21/ottawa-condo-boom.html

Like this comment:

Sad to see such poor planning...can't see the Parliament buildings anymore! Developers rule, as always!.

[S-Man]

What view of the Parliament buildings? You mean the view that was blocked by buildings built in the 1970s? Do people live in reality here? New buildings built behind other buildings won't make the one in front transparent.

But yes, there is a dire need for rental buildings. Not everyone makes enough to pay $500 in condo fees on top of the condo cost every month. It seems Ottawa is trying to drive out 'undesirables' from its population, but that's probably just paranoia talking.

[amanfromnowhere]

What view of the Parliament buildings? You mean the view that was blocked by buildings built in the 1970s?

that's not my comment! i found it so funny so i decided to share it:-)

[Cre47]

that's not my comment! i found it so funny so i decided to share it:-)

Well he just needs to move to Gatineau, the CBC viewer will likely have a perfect view. And even more once some of the planned or future towers will be built there.

[S-Man]

Added my two cents to the CBC article online; most commenters approved of higher density downtown but didn't like the lack of rentals.
Funny, usually about 36 hours after a story like this comes out in the CBC a big group of commenters come online en masse and swings the balance back in favour of NIMBYism and stagnation (judging by the sudden, inexplicable upswing in thumbs-down for pro-intensification comments, and the thumbs up for the reverse.

Seems NIMBYs are slow to react, or at least notice, online articles.

Gems like this:
People in that neighbourhood (Westboro) are doomed to living in a wind tunnel...There is a mass exodus of people in that area who are unhappy with the new Westboro.

[Cre47]

I know some here are critical about vacant empty lots in Ottawa that have been neglected, but the city of Gatineau isn't fairing better.

I had talked in a separate thread about St-Joseph Blvd being neglected. Seems Maisonneuve Blvd is another artery that has been neglected. The condition of the road is the first thing we could notice. But there are a bunch of vacant lots and other ugly looking buildings that would definitely need some attention. While riding route 10 for the past few months, I could at least discover two relatively large lots previously occupied with homes that are now just filled with weeds and other crap and it's been like this for several years with no plans to fill this out. That would be nice to add a couple of towers there right?

And anyone has been travelling near the Hautes Plaines Blvd area right along Hwy 5. There is a 3 km road called Blvd de la Technologie that is almost a road to nowhere (well except this summer with the Stats Canada office) filled with cracked, potholes, etc (and during this summer a good road to speed race too). There is like an abandoned home right at the start of the area (and seems in the past couple of weeks there were fire trucks parked there quite often). There presently only three small businesses in operation there. The Stats Canada DOC building is being vacated right now because yep people like me are done right over there thus leaving a giant shell empty. The city has been neglected this area for a long time and if they want to attract the number of businesses they want, I think a redevelopment of this area is necessary.

[WadiRum]

City centre unprepared for condo influx

Diane Holmes decries lack of amenitiesas committee approves another highrise

BY DAVID REEVELY, THE OTTAWA CITIZEN OCTOBER 26, 2011

An 18-storey condo project at 346 Gloucester St. was approved by the city’s planning committee Tuesday.
OTTAWA — The city is happy to see thousands of people lining up to buy new downtown condominiums, but it doesn’t have a plan for supplying the amenities that make for nice neighbourhoods, city council’s planning committee heard Tuesday morning as it debated a new highrise at 346 Gloucester St.

The 18-storey tower itself, though it’s opposed by Somerset Councillor Diane Holmes (who finds it too tall, stuffed into an odd-shaped lot with two blank faces and an unconvincing “glass hat” to prettify the top), received unanimous approval from the committee. Holmes did, however, get support for an effort to look at whether the city government is really ready for what’s going on downtown.

The city compiles an annual development report that offers numbers but no evaluation. Last year, for instance, 44 per cent of Ottawa’s construction was in areas targeted for intensification, when the city was hoping for 36 per cent.

“It seems we are just marching along with the bubble and having no analytical capacity to say, ‘What should we be doing?’ ” Holmes said.

If the city isn’t ready, a good part of the problem is the city’s own doing. For many years, city politicians and planners have thought downtown’s biggest problem is a lack of people, especially after business hours, and more condos the best solution.

Way back in 1994, the pre-amalgamation Ottawa started waiving development charges — fees cities levy on construction projects to help pay for the services new residents and business will use, from water pipes to parkland — to revive downtown construction.

The program evolved and narrowed over the years as downtown projects picked up, but didn’t end completely until the beginning of August this year. And there was a two-year delay, so any developer with a condo-shaped twinkle in his eye rushed to get projects submitted by the deadline.

The amounts aren’t small. The city charges between $5,700 and $8,000 per unit for new apartments and condos inside the Greenbelt, depending how many bedrooms they have. For a medium-sized building like 346 Gloucester, with 200 units, that’s between $1 million and $1.5 million. Considering the city spent less than $60,000 on a new play structure in Osgoode recently, that money could go a long way.

Now, Holmes brandishes an information sheet showing that in her Somerset ward alone, the city has issued building permits for 430 condo units and a further 3,600 are working their way through the city’s approval process. These are all in addition to towers that are under construction now or have recently been finished.

“We should have ended it sooner, and we shouldn’t have given two years’ warning,” Holmes says of the fee holiday.

Holmes worries that there’s a bubble in the condo market, with would-be residents giving way to investors who rent units out, and investors giving way to speculators who care even less about the buildings they buy into.

And even if there isn’t a bubble, Holmes worries that the city isn’t doing much to make downtown a welcoming place to live.

The city actively wants more people living downtown, but it also wants a demographic mix, and most condos are being built for singles and retirees, Holmes said. Even if families wanted to move in, there’s a shortage of city amenities. Centretown is OK for open grass, but not much for slides and swings. “Where’s the (new) downtown library? Where are the parks?” she asked. Services like community health programs and day cares struggle to keep up.

It’s not just development charges that could pay for some of these things. The city is also close to setting guidelines for concessions and compensation it hopes to extract from developers who get rezonings to erect buildings taller than the rules ordinarily allow — something it’s had the power to do under the provincial Planning Act for nearly 30 years but never got around to. In planning jargon, these are called “Section 37s,” for the part of the law that allows them.

The city has already done a handful of similar deals in a less formal fashion. For instance, it extracted $1 million from Claridge Homes in exchange for permission to build two very big towers at Gloucester and Metcalfe Streets. The money paid for a renovation to the dog run at Jack Purcell Park and landscaping for neglected road allowances.

Holmes got help from the vice-chair of the planning committee, Councillor Jan Harder, who announced she’ll formally request the study Holmes wants at the committee’s next meeting.

Cities from Chicago (“my new favourite place”) to Vancouver to Barcelona manage to include small amenities in dense, historic neighbourhoods, Harder said, and there’s no reason why Ottawa can’t do the same. Development charges and Section 37 payments are the perfect way to fund pocket-sized parks and start saving for bigger projects, she said.

“Whether it’s a play structure or even just some benches to sit on, that’s definitely something we can do,” she said. “You need those things.” Downtown might not have room for the sprawling parks like those in Harder’s Barrhaven ward, she said, but there is space for neighbourhood-scale amenities and the city should have specific policies for providing them.

The study would also look at how well the city’s more mundane infrastructure, like its sewer and water pipes, can handle more development. One premise supporting downtown intensification is that the city doesn’t have to lay new pipes and roads for it, but the pipes can’t accommodate new condo towers indefinitely.

As for 346 Gloucester, the planning committee voted for the tower despite confusion over whether it’s subject to the new development-charge regime. The builder, Richcraft, argues it only would be if the revised plan included more units than had already been approved. The committee asked the city’s legal department to provide an opinion before full city council takes the plans up on Nov. 9.

dreevely@ottawacitizen.com

ottawacitizen.com/greaterottawa

Read more: http://www.ottawacitizen.com/news/City+centre+unprepared+condo+influx/5605801/story.html#ixzz1bwQ7g195

[Nepean]

I just came back from the AGM of the Centrepointe Community Association where Richcraft made a presentation about a proposed condo project. The proposal is to build two condo buildings -- one 24-stories; the other 22 -- on the corner of Centrepointe and Constellation Drive.

The proposal is to build a total of 340 units, with three floors of underground parking. In terms of timelines, if everything is approved quickly, shovels could be in the ground in 2013.

As expected, a few people expressed concerns about the height, that too many units were being proposed, and the impact on traffic flows. However, there were also some practical questions: e.g. would the building be build to a Leeds-standard (yes); and how many units per floor (eight).

Further community discussion is expected to take place as this project moves forward.

[Uhuniau]

What lot is that Centrepointe project proposed for?

And is it far enough in the west end that no one will bitch about tall buildings spoiling the view?

[MountainView]

And is it far enough in the west end that no one will bitch about tall buildings spoiling the view?

LOL!
If the lot is at Centrepointe and Constellation there really isn't much homes that the shadows will affect in that area and it is right beside Baseline Station! It's prime for intensification there. Hopefully there will be some rentals included in this project as I'm sure many algonquinites and people who work in the West will like the idea of renting!

[Nepean]

LOL!
If the lot is at Centrepointe and Constellation there really isn't much homes that the shadows will affect in that area and it is right beside Baseline Station! It's prime for intensification there. Hopefully there will be some rentals included in this project as I'm sure many algonquinites and people who work in the West will like the idea of renting!

It's funny that you mention Algonquin students, as one person raised concerns about investors buying up a large number of condos, and in turn renting them to students who would cause trouble in the neighbourhood. To be fair to the people at the meeting, however, this was not a prominent point of view.

[kevinbottawa]

Watson's idea for a "green express lane" for green projects. The development summit mentioned in the last line should be interesting.

Watson wants ‘green express lane’ for City of Ottawa building permits

By David Reevely, The Ottawa Citizen October 26, 2011

OTTAWA — Environmentally sound building projects should get extra-swift treatment from the city’s planning department, Mayor Jim Watson told city councillors in unveiling his proposed budget for 2012.

“Starting next year we will provide a ‘green express lane’ for developments that strive for more,” Watson said. “We will set a tough standard for housing, buildings and renovations to qualify for the green express lane.”

The goal is to identify and publicize better building techniques the city wants to favour — solar hot-water heaters, for instance, or systems that use rainwater for bathrooms — and reward builders who want to use them by having them treated by a completely separate team in the city’s planning and building departments.

“Projects will qualify based on planned energy and water efficiency, construction waste minimization, and overall environmental footprint,” a city description of the plan says, although there are no specific funds attached to it.

The idea is a response to two frequent criticisms of the city: that planning approvals take too long (though the budget notes with some pride that the number of building permits issued within the legal time limit has gone from 65 per cent five years ago to over 90 per cent) and that city building officials are stymied by new techniques and technology for which they don’t already have a playbook.

Indeed, for four years ending in 2007, the city simply refused to issue permits for solar hot-water heaters because there wasn’t a national standard for them. That changed when the Ontario Building Code was finally updated to include the long-used technology.

After the budget presentation, Watson also said he hopes to set “benchmarks” in 2012 for how long each phase of a planning approval should take and eventually promise discounts when the city doesn’t meet the targets.

“Each transaction would have to be different because obviously a site plan for a subdivision is substantially different than putting a veranda on your backyard, so we’d have to judge it accordingly to the scope and magnitude of the project,” Watson said.

The head of the city’s planning department, John Moser, immediately began lowering the boom on his staff in a mid-afternoon memo obtained by the Citizen. “I am sympathetic to the nature of our profession — of the regulatory role that we play, of the myriad of legislation and interests that we balance every day,” he wrote. “But there has never been a greater time to improve our operations than now. We will all be under an increased microscope in 2012 and we must deliver or face collective consequences.”

The other explicitly pro-environment measure in the budget is $1.4 million for the city’s fund for buying environmentally sensitive land. Watson also promised to pursue money from the federal and provincial budgets to upgrade the city’s sewers so they vent less sewage into the Ottawa River during heavy rains, and to worker harder to enforce zoning and community design plans despite some builders’ requests to erect bigger buildings than the rules allow.

“We are going to make infill work,” Watson said, and complained of the costs of fights over enforcing the rules. “This council will be asking more of builders. Developers will be expected to pay for the full cost of the growth in infrastructure they cause.”

He also promised a “summit” on development in the winter. “The current system just is not working, plain and simple.”

dreevely@ottawacitizen.com

ottawacitizen.com/greaterottawa

© Copyright (c) The Ottawa Citizen

Read more: http://www.ottawacitizen.com/Watson+wants+green+express+lane+City+Ottawa+building+permits/5611790/story.html#ixzz1bzI4TAaz

[S-Man]

Good to hear of intensification at Centrepointe and next to Baseline Station. There's a library and services at Ben Franklin Place, too. Hopefully rental properties, too.

Cue Ken Grey!

[Cre47]

I just came back from the AGM of the Centrepointe Community Association where Richcraft made a presentation about a proposed condo project. The proposal is to build two condo buildings -- one 24-stories; the other 22 -- on the corner of Centrepointe and Constellation Drive.

The proposal is to build a total of 340 units, with three floors of underground parking. In terms of timelines, if everything is approved quickly, shovels could be in the ground in 2013.

As expected, a few people expressed concerns about the height, that too many units were being proposed, and the impact on traffic flows. However, there were also some practical questions: e.g. would the building be build to a Leeds-standard (yes); and how many units per floor (eight).

Further community discussion is expected to take place as this project moves forward.

There were supposed to be multiple buildings at over 10 stories in the Centrepointe if I remember from a plan that was like several years ago. I guess then other then the Algonquin buildings and the Archives, nothing has been built in terms of residential. I guess the plan was ditched.

[S-Man]

In similar news, Diane Holmes (aka Mrs. 1982) has made the CBC and the top news story on Yahoo Canada, thanks to her views on opposing building downtown.

http://ca.news.yahoo.com/hot-ottawa-condo-market-could-cool-114122876.html

If you recall, she opposed Tribeca because of the height and lack of amenities (but mostly height), then when the builder said they would bring a grocery store/day care to the area as part of the project, she voted against it because there would be seven delivery trucks going to the building each day. This woman is not trying for sustainability or amenities downtown, she's just aiming for no new development downtown (otherwise she would seek solutions).

[Nepean]

There were supposed to be multiple buildings at over 10 stories in the Centrepointe if I remember from a plan that was like several years ago. I guess then other then the Algonquin buildings and the Archives, nothing has been built in terms of residential. I guess the plan was ditched.

The architect of the Centrepointe / Constellation project spoke during the CCA meeting yesterday. When questioned by one resident about the proposed height (i.e. 24-stories and 22 respectively) he said that this height will match the future buildings that are expected to be built as part of Centrepointe Town Centre. I found the statement to be very interesting.

From what I understand, the general plan for the area is to build the underground bus station at Baseline, and then move the current station underground, and continue building Centrepointe Town Centre on top of what is presently the bus terminal.

[MountainView]

The architect of the Centrepointe / Constellation project spoke during the CCA meeting yesterday. When questioned by one resident about the proposed height (i.e. 24-stories and 22 respectively) he said that this height will match the future buildings that are expected to be built as part of Centrepointe Town Centre. I found the statement to be very interesting.

From what I understand, the general plan for the area is to build the underground bus station at Baseline, and then move the current station underground, and continue building Centrepointe Town Centre on top of what is presently the bus terminal.

From: http://www.ottawa.ca/calendar/ottawa/citycouncil/csedc/2007/10-16/ACS2007-CMR-CSE-0012-%28Complete%29.htm

http://www.ottawa.ca/calendar/ottawa/citycouncil/csedc/2007/10-16/ACS2007-CMR-CSE-0012-(Complete)_files/image006.jpg

Difficult to see/read but this is the 2007 Centrepointe Town Centre concept plan

[Uhuniau]

Difficult to see/read but this is the 2007 Centrepointe Town Centre concept plan

I always get a kick out of "Focal Point".

To me, it reads "Overplanned Designated Public Open Happy Space That No One Will Ever Ever Use Except For Getting To Or From Underground Baseline Station (If It Ever Opens)".

[citizen j]

I always get a kick out of "Focal Point".

To me, it reads "Overplanned Designated Public Open Happy Space That No One Will Ever Ever Use Except For Getting To Or From Underground Baseline Station (If It Ever Opens)".

3 words:
hot dog vendor

[S-Man]

Don't knock hot dog vendors. They make empty public open space worth visiting. Mmmmm.....

[citizen j]

Precisely. I was thinking about Bank and Laurier's 'focal point.'

[Uhuniau]

3 words:
hot dog vendor

Bring it! Better yet: vendors of other kinds of food.