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Pavlov
Aug 22, 2007, 9:30 PM
This is the fifth of nine photo threads documenting a recent trip through Inner Asia. If you missed the first (Hong Kong and Beijing), you can find it here (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=134607). If you missed the second part (Jiayuguan and Turfan), you can find it here (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=134983). If you missed the third part (Kashgar) you can find it here (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=135364). If you missed the fourth part (Tashkurgan, Gilgit, and the Khunjerab Pass), you can find it here (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=135826).

01. China: Hong Kong and Beijing
02. China: Jiayuguan and Turfan
03. China: Kashgar
04. China to Pakistan: Tashkurgan, Gilgit, and the Khunjerab Pass
05. Pakistan to Afghanistan: Rawalpindi, Peshawar, and Kabul
06. Afghanistan: the Hazarajat
07. Afghanistan: the North
08. Uzbekistan: Samarkand
09. Uzbekistan: Bukhara and Tashkent

DISCLAIMER: This region is home to some of the most raw, most beautiful scenery on earth. It is home to some of the most ancient, most romantic cities on earth but also to some of the cruelest, most wretched poverty on earth. And of course, it is home to some of the friendliest, strangest, most resilient, most fascinating people on earth. My photos do not even come close to capturing the contradicitions and complexities of this ancient corner of the world. I strongly encourage anyone who is interested to see it for themselves.

* I only have a handful of photographs from Rawalpindi and Peshawar. Really, this is a shame. Peshawar is fascinating, romantic, and exotic. Rawalpindi is dirty, grimy, and chaotic. I could have taken hundreds of interesting photographs (including a monkey riding on the back of an antelope). Unfortunately, for the two and a half weeks I spent in these two cities I was constantly sick and daytime highs never dipped below 40 degrees Celsius. Therefore, I couldn't be bothered to haul my camera around with me. Luckily, I was feeling much better by the time I crossed the Khyber Pass into Afghanistan.

Also, I apologize that this thread is so hastily slapped together, but I really have no spare time right now.

Rawalpindi

I kind of hate Rawalpindi. Its dirty and appallingly hot.

01. This is Rawalpindi. Kilometre after kilometre along Murree road of bazaars exactly like this (although, in the machinery shop districts, things are particularly grimy). The "bus station" is an empty lot with piles of burning garbage. There was also a dead dog in the open sewer. I arrived on a night of nationwide political protests (against the dismissal of the Pakistan's Chief Justice) which left 40 people dead in Karachi. I could hear machine gun fire all night long as the army fired into the air, trying to disperse the crowds.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Rawalpindi/Rawalpindi03.jpg

02. Murree Rd, Rawalpindi's spine.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Rawalpindi/Rawalpindi09.jpg

03. More bazaars (this is near Committee Chowk I believe).

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Rawalpindi/Rawalpindi01.jpg

04. A dust storm (which was really more of a garbage storm).

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Rawalpindi/Rawalpindi08.jpg

05. India and Britain's colonialism marriage produced some strange children.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Rawalpindi/Rawalpindi02.jpg

06. A rare quiet alley, away from the chaos and confusion of Pindi.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Rawalpindi/Rawalpindi05.jpg

07. The Venice of the subcontinent...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Rawalpindi/Rawalpindi06.jpg

08. ...almost.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Rawalpindi/Rawalpindi07.jpg

Peshawar

Peshawar is a major city in the Pashtun heartland of Pakistan's Northwest Frontier Province. It is less than 100 km from the Afghan border and is home to many Afghan refugees and immigrants. Osama Bin Laden is allegedly hiding in a cave somewhere an hour or two south of here. While I was there a bomb blast assassinated a Taliban informant, along with 30 innocent Afghans, at a hotel in the city's outskirts. Yes, this is now the wild, wild west.

09. The Khyber Bazaar.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Peshawar/Peshawar02.jpg

10. An example of Peshawar's famous carved facades.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Peshawar/Peshawar13.jpg

The Khyber Pass

The Khyber Pass is probably the most romantic, evocative border in the world. It winds through Pakistan's Pashtun Tribal Areas, where Pakistan's government has no authority. This area is a major smuggling port on the Opium routes out of Afghanistan to East Asia. Foreigners are required to hire a private armed guard to escort them into the Tribal Areas. Pashtun men casually run errands with a Kalishnikov machine gun slung on their shoulder. At the smuggler's bazaar just outside of Peshawar one can easily buy an AK-47 and a shoebox-sized brick of Hashish or Opium.

11. Looking back over the pass.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Khyber%20Pass/KhyberPass01.jpg

12. Me posing with my dwarf-like armed escort.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Khyber%20Pass/KhyberPass05.jpg

Afghanistan

Visiting Afghanistan is like travelling back through time a thousand years. There is no electricity (except for the handful of people and businesses that can afford absurdly expensive gasoline generators). There is no plumbing. Often, there is no law and order. The poverty is appalling. Beggars with one leg, or just as often no legs at all, crowd the sidewalks in the cities.

Its a fascinating place to visit, but truly I am lucky not to live there.

13. Afghanistan is, if nothing else, a land of dramatic landscapes. Here a tiny village clings to the shore of a lake, surrounded by desert and mountain.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan02.jpg

14. Wrecked Soviet tanks still dot every road in Afghanistan.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan01-1.jpg

15. They are a real tourist attraction (me posing).

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan16.jpg

16. Eating lunch (flatbread and fresh yoghurt) at a typical Afghan chaikhana. This is the only dining option outside the few major cities. There are only three things on the menu: rice, kebab, and yoghurt.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan14.jpg

17. Afghans drinking tea outside another chaikhana.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan06.jpg

18. A typical adobe Afghan dwelling. This is how maybe 80% of Afghans live.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan12.jpg

19. A shepherd and his flock.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan11.jpg

20. Another typical Afghan landscape.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan09.jpg

21. The Afghan man I rode the bus with. He is a Geology professor who sent his daughter (his only family still alive) to Germany during the war.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Afghanistan/Afghanistan08.jpg

Kabul

Downtown Kabul is (relatively) booming, fuelled by Afghan businessmen returning from Europe and millions of dollars of development money (as well as the high-salaried aid workers and journalists that accompany it). However, outside a few squre blocks in the city centre, the city sprawls into slums that spread up the sides of the Kabul's mountains. These slums are no place for a foreigner to wander into. Indeed, the entire city is frequently the scene of bombings and abductions, and nowhere is it safe for anyone (even a local) to walk around after dark.

22. Bombed-out west Kabul.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul11.jpg

23. More.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul10.jpg

24. More.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul07.jpg

25. The old palace, pock-marked by machinegun fire.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul06.jpg

26. A detail.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul13.jpg

27. A machine-gun nest overlooking the city. Kabul is heavily militarised. American and Turkish armoured personnel carriers routinely patrol the city.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul09.jpg

28. Slums spreading up the hillside. At first one might expect hillside property to be the most sought-after. However, once you consider that filling a bathtub in these neighbourhoods requires several walks up and down the hill to fill a bucket at the well at the bottom, it becomes obvious why these are Kabul's poorest neighbourhoods.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul27.jpg

29. More.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul28.jpg

30. More.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul25.jpg

31. One more. I think they make a rather dramatic backdrop for a city.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul24.jpg

32. OK, one more.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul15.jpg

33. Looming over the Kabul River.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul21.jpg

34. Streetlife.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul22.jpg

35. A bombed-out building leans precariously over a bazaar.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul33.jpg

36. Another bazaar shot.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul20.jpg

37. Another.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul16.jpg

38. Another.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul30.jpg

39. ...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul47.jpg

40. ...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul45.jpg

41. The clothing market.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul44.jpg

42. Carpet market.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul43.jpg

43. More carpet market.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul42.jpg

44. More.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul41.jpg

45. The bird market.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul40.jpg

46. More bird market.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul38.jpg

47. ...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul37.jpg

48. ...

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul36.jpg

49. A pair of money-changers.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul34.jpg

50. A lovely mosque in the city centre.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul23.jpg

51. Another under construction (or reconstruction). That scaffolding catwalk looks positively terrifying.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul18.jpg

52. A monument in the small European cementary to the Canadian soldiers who fell in Kabul. The cemetary is still cared for by the same old man who cared for it during the Soviet invasion, the civil war, the reign of the Taliban, and the Allied invasion, all at great personal risk.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul01.jpg

53. The amusing (yet ominous) list of room services at my hotel, the famous Mustafa hotel.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y128/reesonov/RAWALPINDIKABUL/Kabul/Kabul48.jpg

The End.

the dude
Aug 22, 2007, 10:12 PM
an amazing tour. did you get to keep the ak47?

HomeInMyShoes
Aug 22, 2007, 11:37 PM
Amazing indeed. Thanks for sharing these glimpses from your trip Reesonov.

Awkab
Aug 23, 2007, 12:59 AM
Amazing tour and photos...thanks so much for sharing. I'm really looking forward to seeing your photos from the Northern part of the country (are you visiting Badakhshan?)

boden
Aug 23, 2007, 1:15 AM
Quite an incredible series.....
Thank you for posting them.

Jesus in a Geo
Aug 23, 2007, 2:21 AM
wow, wow, wow. Thank you, thank you, thank you.


I've been lurking a lot here over the past few months and I've never seen a threa that's elicited such a response in me. For the first time after viewing a thread, I actually have many questions. Did you ever feel threatened? I'm shocked you went into such "dangerous" areas with such an ostensibly western appearence. What was it like over there? Is it as lawless as the media make it seem?


My god, this is an awesome series.

Boris
Aug 23, 2007, 2:39 AM
Very interesting thread. Thoroughly enjoyed it. However, I must say, you're lucky you didn't lose your head; literally.

900BiscayneGuy
Aug 23, 2007, 3:29 AM
Very interesting. Thanks!

Jimby
Aug 23, 2007, 3:30 AM
Absolutely fantastic and fascinating photos. What a trip that must have been.

Urban Zombie
Aug 23, 2007, 4:34 AM
Wow--this thread is beyond fascinating. I'd never have the balls to go to some of these places. Good for you!

Austinlee
Aug 23, 2007, 4:51 AM
This whole thread is bizarre/bazaar. Thanks for showing me the city, cause I can assure you that I will NEVER go to that place myself!

WonderlandPark
Aug 23, 2007, 4:53 AM
This is so my dream trip you are on, oh man, gotta get out into Central Asia next year. Awesome shots, loved the armed guard services at the hotel.

Thx so much for posting.

jerrywcca
Aug 23, 2007, 5:20 AM
Wow, one of the most incredible threads I've ever seem on here. Rawalpindi looks absolutely brutal, especially shot number 2. Thanks for a wonderful post.

Muji
Aug 23, 2007, 5:21 AM
Awesome photos! It's amazing to think of the thousands of people living in those places.

ady26
Aug 23, 2007, 7:28 AM
I guess it was pretty dangerous to go there! Anyway...Welcome To Third World!:cheers:

olga
Aug 23, 2007, 8:34 AM
05. India and Britain's colonialism marriage produced some strange children.


:haha: That's hilarious.

wow, wow, wow. Thank you, thank you, thank you.


I second that.

Did you ever feel threatened?

Hey, he was escorted by an armed Gimli, must have been safe! ;)

giovanni sasso
Aug 23, 2007, 11:28 AM
what a great series.

i used to date a girl from rawalpindi, but she definitely didn't live in any squalor like that. her family was military oriented (her father was a general of some sort and they lived in a palace), and while we were dating (here in the US, of course), the musharraf coup happened. she was already a little unstable, and i was her first boyfriend ever (they don't really have a dating scene in traditional islamic pakistan), so needless to say that was a pretty heavy couple of months.

but the kabul pictures, man. outta sight.

well done, reesonov, and congrats on such a unique trip.

LSyd
Aug 23, 2007, 1:20 PM
wow. i really want to go to kabul. i'll definitely have a chance to in a couple of years. glad you got back from your trip safely, it looks like you had fun. what souvenirs did you get, carpets and stuff?

-

Tom In Chicago
Aug 23, 2007, 5:12 PM
Your photo-threads are the best ever. . . these snapshots around this part of the world offer greater insight than any sanitized National Geographic overview. . .

Chelsea Spy
Aug 23, 2007, 5:35 PM
fantastic pictures - what an epic journey - awesome!!!

niwell
Aug 23, 2007, 6:07 PM
WOW! I've somehow managed to miss all of these photothreads, but looking through now they are nothing short of amazing. These are so far from the North American idea of an urban landscape it's quite a shock to see.

hlwjw06
Aug 23, 2007, 6:24 PM
Holy Hayzeus!! Great slices of wild west life.

Thx man,
glad u got outta there~

soleri
Aug 23, 2007, 7:46 PM
stunning. It's a like sheer horror placed alongside incredible beauty.

raph93
Aug 23, 2007, 8:23 PM
just perfect! thx!

Complex01
Aug 23, 2007, 9:23 PM
If that does not open your eyes, i dont know what does. That is just amazing, it really makes your appreciate what you have. What an experience to say the least. Thanks for sharing...

Jonas
Aug 23, 2007, 9:39 PM
Extremely interesting... I scrolled slowly through every picture and enjoyed every single one of them. After all we don't get to see this part of the world here too often. So thanks for that :tup:

giallo
Aug 24, 2007, 2:48 AM
The ball is out of the park. Awesome tour.

VivaLFuego
Aug 26, 2007, 8:07 AM
....wow

Pavlov
Aug 27, 2007, 11:14 PM
Thanks for the positive comments everyone. I hope you enjoy these threads.


Amazing tour and photos...thanks so much for sharing. I'm really looking forward to seeing your photos from the Northern part of the country (are you visiting Badakhshan?)

No, not really. Perhaps the road north to Mazar passes through the western part of Badakhshan? I'm not really sure. But even if it does I didn't stop for more than lunch or tea on that road.

wow. i really want to go to kabul. i'll definitely have a chance to in a couple of years. glad you got back from your trip safely, it looks like you had fun. what souvenirs did you get, carpets and stuff?

As long as you're willing to accept a certain amount of risk and a certain amount of discomfort, then I really recommend Afghanistan as a destination. Like I said in the thread, it is as close to time travel as you can find. And, although obviously tourism is not a pancea for all of Afghanistan's problems, I do believe that building relationships between Afghans and people from the rest of the world is an important part of Afghanistan's recovery.

Hey, he was escorted by an armed Gimli, must have been safe!

:yes:

Swinefeld
Aug 29, 2007, 12:18 AM
Stunning (and educational) photo tour. I'm surprised to see the women still wearing burqas. Uh, didn't the US liberate Afghan women? Hmmm...

Great pics! :tup:

M II A II R II K
Mar 2, 2008, 11:17 PM
That was certainly a very unique tour, gives one a sense of being taken on that trip.

And this is completely unlike and much more than seeing these places on TV on the news all the time.

Minato Ku
Mar 3, 2008, 12:14 AM
Wow I don't find my words. :eek:

elmo
Mar 3, 2008, 12:28 AM
Perhaps the most intriguing thread we've seen on here in quite some time...thank for sharing!

JManc
Mar 3, 2008, 1:21 AM
these are amazing.

Bergenser
Mar 3, 2008, 11:09 AM
That was a great trip.
That "mountain town" looks awsome. :D

Stephen Ave
Mar 3, 2008, 10:22 PM
Wow, fantastic photos Reesvonov! Truly awesome!

salvius
Mar 4, 2008, 4:56 AM
I am in shock. Absolutely amazing!

Jaroslaw
Mar 4, 2008, 5:08 AM
This is great stuff. Brings back memories of Quetta. I thought I wouldn't go back to those parts now, but maybe I should reconsider. Were you using a Canadian passport?

Pavlov
Mar 4, 2008, 5:20 AM
Wow. I'm surprised to see this old thread bumped from the dead. It reminds me to point out how inadequate my photos are in showing how interesting and beautiful those cities were. Peshawar is especially poorly represented. The Khyber bazaar is one of the most exotic shopping destinations in the world and I didn't take one photo. I wish I would have brought one of the forum's many talented photographers along with me. Oh well.

To answer your question Jaroslaw, yes, I was using a Canadian passport. Canadians are very well recieved in Pakistan because of our large Pakistani community here. Nearly everyone I met had some family in Canada. Also, Canadian passport was fine in Afghanistan, where I had a very similar reception.

Sigh, looking over this thread again makes me a little sad. I had a great time on that trip, and met some incredible people. I highly recommend it (with the caveat of course that you must be willing to accept slightly more risk and discomfort and frustration than a typical vacation).

EDIT: I didn't make it as far south as Quetta, so I'm not sure exactly what the security situation is down there, although I did meet one or two people who had been and they didn't seem too concerned about it. I'm not sure how much worse Pakistan's stability is these days.

Sonoran_Dweller
Mar 8, 2008, 5:08 PM
AMAZING!!!! Afghanistan is so much more beautiful and interesting than the US media portrays.

jeffwhit
Mar 12, 2008, 9:46 PM
damn.

seriosuly

Magnus1
Mar 13, 2008, 1:51 AM
whoa... you go were US troops won't. your pictures of 'the pass' were facinating. More interstate death dealing has occured there than anywhere else since the soviet incursion. it's the wild west! you have large rocks my friend.

FREKI
Mar 13, 2008, 5:12 AM
Great pics - and very interesting...

I thought parts of Southern Iraq looked beat up but Kabul deffinetly takes the price!

Scoutthedog
Mar 14, 2008, 4:10 AM
these pics make me think of The Kite Runner. amazing tour

Harry Cane
Mar 14, 2008, 2:00 PM
I was just thinking the same thing. Just finished the book and it made me think of places in the novel. Gotta get to the movie. I think the DVD is coming out soon.

Incredible pics.

Pavlov
Mar 15, 2008, 8:32 PM
Frankly, I thought that both the novel and the film were mediocre. However, if you do watch the film adaptation of Kite Runner, you may be interested to know that the Peshawar and Kabul scenes are filmed in Kashgar (in Xinjiang region of China). If you like, you can check out my Kashgar photo thread here: Kashgar, Tomb of the Fragrant Concubine (http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showthread.php?t=135364). You will recognize a number of streets from the film.

Boris2k7
Mar 15, 2008, 8:42 PM
That's funny. You were willing to go where the film crews would not. :cool:

You, sir, are very GAR.

FYI:
A term used towards male characters and individuals who are so overwhelmingly manly that your own masculinity is absolutely *buried*, leaving you naught but a whimpering, swooning girl-child before them.

Mercutio
Mar 17, 2008, 1:39 PM
You're brave man travelling to Afghanistan. Fascinating photos thanks.... :)

dktshb
Mar 17, 2008, 1:48 PM
Wow it's nice to see Pakistan and Afghanistan up close an personal. Great shots.

PhilippeMtl
Mar 17, 2008, 8:23 PM
Just... Wow

ltsmotorsport
Mar 19, 2008, 5:26 AM
Impressive. Glad it was bumped for all to see again.

staff
Mar 19, 2008, 11:18 AM
I can't believe I haven't written a post in this thread.

These threads are what makes SSP a great, great site. Thank you very much for bringing you camera on the trip, and then sharing your pics with us, Reesonov.

IMBY
Dec 14, 2012, 2:18 PM
I know you won't believe me, but I found these cities to be more inviting than San Francisco or Rio.:haha:

I just love grimey, dirty, run down, 3rd world cities, and I see the beauty in them, and it tempts me to get in a plane and fly right over there and get dirty with rest of them!:banana:

My big fear is, one day, the whole planet is going to get cleaned up, and sterilized and then I may as well curl up and die!

Cities that are too clean with hardly a hair out of place, I find disturbing and uncomfortable!:whip: