Atlanta: SMALL projects that would make a lot of difference?

[greg30127]

With the emphasis on here of course being larger projects (skyscrapers, multi-use projects, etc), I thought if it's ok I'd start a thread just to toss around ideas about TINY projects that would still make a difference into the quality of life in the city.

Example: When you are exiting the Aquarium or World of Coke downtown and face Left toward Peachtree Street from Baker, you are faced with a rather steep hill if you want to walk to the Peachtree district. Whenever I'm down here I see people struggling to make it up that hill. Older folks, handicapped people in wheelchairs, and even someone like me with a bum knee, have a hard time getting up the steep incline. Perhaps one day the vision of a Trolley will come true, but that's years away (if at all). For now, it's hoofing it, take a cab (dumb for just a few blocks), or walking through Centennial Park and getting up to the lower end of Peachtree via the less sloped walkways on that side (a much further walk for the elderly or handicapped).

When I was in Chattanooga recently and left their Aquarium, I noticed they have quite a bit of residential development in-between the Aquarium and the Bluff Arts district they have a couple of blocks East of there. If you walk from one area to the other, there is a steep hillside. Well, they installed an incline lift there and it's pretty darn neat. Basically just an elevator that goes up an incline, but it really was being heavily used by the above mentioned types of people. I think a very similar thing such as this along Baker Street downtown would make a world of difference to pedestrians. Being a bit longer than the one in Chattanooga, they could even install a "stop" or two along the incline to allow people to exit/enter halfway up via the hotel and businesses along there.

Photo of the Chattanooga incline lift:

http://www.pbase.com/powdersprings/image/82600050.jpg

Comments about this idea are welcome, but it would be nice to see the thread filled with ideas of other small ideas that would help out around town as well. It's nice to think big, but sometimes it's the small details that make quality of life nice, too.

[Fiorenza]

Funny you should mention it. I was thinking of a funicular from Vinings town center to the highest point of Mt. Wilkinson...

http://p.vtourist.com/1/1587513-What_Goes_Up_Must_Come_Down-Prague.jpg

[Tombstoner]

A few well-placed, artistically significant fountains.

[MidtownMile]

I agree entirely with the fountains.

Another project I have always wanted to see is the transformation of some of our smaller parks into sculpture gardens. I think this could be a nice signature element for Atlanta. Use the Botanical Gardens as the sort of crown jewel, then give each park its own style of outdoor art, particularly if it reflects its surroundings (think Found Object sculptures for Inman Park/L5P, classic Georgian art for Grant Park, Modern Pieces for COP, Industrial Art for AS, etc.). Would make for an amazing trolley tour for tourists I would think.

[L.ARCH]

Speaking of parks, I think a park over the connector (@ Peachtree St.) would be great for Atlanta. It would definitely help give the area a new identity and perhaps encourage further development... heal the urban fabric?

[RobMidtowner]

Put better landscaping around each of the ramps for every interchange on the connector. Something that would create a distinct boundary/entrance for the city. Anything would look better than the grass that's there now and if done right could prevent bums from panhandling there.

[Chris Creech]

well this would be a medium project but I always thought Atlanta is lacking a viewing tower and I'm not really meaning a highrise observation deck (though we could use that too) but something along the lines of a Coit Tower in San Francisco. I always thoght the big hill beside the Carter Library would be perfect, it's on a rise and would give Freedom Park a much needed centerpiece/landmark.

Since Atlanta is home to 2 Nobel Peace winners, you could even call it "Peace" tower and put in a museum to the Nobel Peace prize winners of the past. You could have a carillon in the top, but a nice little walkaruond observation deck with great views of downtown.

Think how nicely that would compliment the Carter Center, MLK Center, and the Rights Museum.

But yeah, generally speaking Atlanta doesn't have many of those centerpieces in any of it's partks. Even Piedmont Park or Grant Park, miss any sort of focus in the parks themselves. (Look how nice it is that Centennial Park has the fountain.)

[Tombstoner]

I think it's important that if Atlanta did fountains or sculptures or even beautified ramps (I like the idea of something to create a kind of "district" feel apart from adding placard to street signs) it be QUALITY -- not the typical suburban, corporate crap that, unfortunately, is so common in Atlanta. That's why I emphasize "artistically significant"; we don't need more McFountains, McMonuments, McParks that only suitably complement the World of Coke. Better just to build more Home Depots than settle for more half-assed garbage.

[mayhem]

Atlanta should install escalators on all sidewalks so no one has to walk anywhere. There could be cup holders on the hand rails for Coke beverages and LCD screens placed every 20 feet with CNN news feeds playing to keep you updated.

[Trae]

Atlanta should install escalators on all sidewalks so no one has to walk anywhere. There could be cup holders on the hand rails for Coke beverages and LCD screens placed every 20 feet with CNN news feeds playing to keep you updated.

Then Atlanta would get real fat. Not a bad proposal though Mayhem :D .

[MarketsWork]

I think it's important that if Atlanta did fountains or sculptures or even beautified ramps... it be QUALITY -- not the typical suburban, corporate crap that, unfortunately, is so common in Atlanta.

The words "suburban" and "corporate" have become so overused on this forum that they have lost any relevant meaning. I think half the people who spout them as pejoratives do so because it feels so cool and superior to dismiss any work of others which fails to live up their own tastes -- which tend to favor wall-to-wall skyscrapers, zero cars and no chain retail. Anything that differs from such Gotham-styled SimCity fantasy is labeled "suburban" or "corporate." In earlier days, New Yorker wannabees would have used words like "hick" or "provincial" to express their insecurities about their own city. There are doers in this world who accomplish important things, and there are talkers who pick them apart. I am grateful to the former, who built and continue to build this city, and I hope they continue to do what makes them -- and all Atlantans -- successful...

[Tombstoner]

...There are doers in this world who accomplish important things, and there are talkers who pick them apart. I am grateful to the former, who built and continue to build this city, and I hope they continue to do what makes them -- and all Atlantans -- successful...

I am grateful to the many Atlantans I know who persist in wanting a quality environment despite the fact that many people are completely satisfied with mediocrity (and are even proud of it).

[dirtybird]

I would like to see street vendors selling newspapers/magazines/candy, fruit, hot dogs, pretzels, ice cream, etc. They might even have to be subsidized in the beginning since it's an unknown market.

[Tombstoner]

:previous: This is an excellent idea! I was thinking awhile back that a million-dollar idea (that, because I would be rich, might even earn me MarketsWorks' respect [something I really crave]) is to import these neat little expresso stands from Brazil where you can essentially get your shot of java and at the same time buy a newspaper. Essentially, the same thing dirtybird suggests. Such stands could be scattered in many little corners that would attract and support street life, increasing a sense of security and civic life. These little stands are circular and self-contained (probably 7' in diameter) and easily locked up like Ft. Knox at night. They ran about $6000 apiece several years ago.

[Terminus]

I would like to see street vendors selling newspapers/magazines/candy, fruit, hot dogs, pretzels, ice cream, etc. They might even have to be subsidized in the beginning since it's an unknown market.

Central Atlanta Progress has been attempting to get the City to clean up the vendors for years now. They are very close to hiring a private company to manage them, but it's challenging. The vending lobby is the most powerful in the city (even more than the taxi cabs), so it's very hard to change anything.

Hopefully this new program will be a success.

[Andrea]

Here's some of the little stuff I'd do:

-- Encourage more newsstands, coffee shops and food vendors. Eliminate or tightly regulate the sale of "knock-off" merchandise on the streets. ETA: Following up on Terminus' post, if the street vendors can't be controlled then eliminate them.

-- Enhance crosswalks with better markings and signals. Post signs saying "Don't forget - Pedestrians have the right of way in this town."

-- Impose mandatory $2,500 fine and 5 year license suspension on motorists who nose into crosswalks in anticipation of turning. Enforce by mobile cameras placed around city at random.

-- Set aside portion of trains and buses for citizens traveling with well-mannered dogs. Mandatory $50,000 fine and 5 year sentence for anyone traveling with dog that bites.

-- Begin reclaiming connector one lane at a time by use of low impact techniques such as barriers, trees, re-striping, etc. Provide intersections and turnarounds every 300 yards (okay to make them dirt or gravel). Encourage commuters to actually engage city rather than bypassing same.

-- Increase penalty under Article XI, Sec. 74-601, et seq., to mandatory $2,500 per day or 5 days of picking up trash.

-- Require developers and utility companies who tear up streets to put them back smooth.

-- Require owners of vacant lots (including parking lots) to put vegetation barrier at least 5' tall at street.

[Andrea]

The words "suburban" and "corporate" have become so overused on this forum that they have lost any relevant meaning. I think half the people who spout them as pejoratives do so because it feels so cool and superior to dismiss any work of others which fails to live up their own tastes ...

I don't see "suburban" or "corporate" as pejoratives. They are quintessential defining characteristics of post-WWII Atlanta.

[catlike]

Here's some of the little stuff I'd do:

-- Enhance crosswalks with better markings and signals. Post signs saying "Don't forget - Pedestrians have the right of way in this town."


We already have these in the crosswalks...except they get run over within 24 hours of placement.

Here's some of the little stuff I'd do:

-- Impose mandatory $2,500 fine and 5 year license suspension on motorists who nose into crosswalks in anticipation of turning. Enforce by mobile cameras placed around city at random.


Give tickets for blocking the box. To an extent, this might be handled by the red light cameras in some intersections, but there are plenty more intersections that could use enforcement.

[Andrea]

We already have these in the crosswalks...except they get run over within 24 hours of placement.

You gotta love this town. I bet if you took a survey 95% of the people in the metro area would say they consider pedestrians an impediment to convenient motoring.

[RobMidtowner]

-- Impose mandatory $2,500 fine and 5 year license suspension on motorists who nose into crosswalks in anticipation of turning. Enforce by mobile cameras placed around city at random.


Another less agressive way of controlling this is to prohibit right turns on red....although that is also regularly disregarded in my observations.

[(four 0 four)]

Here's some of the little stuff I'd do:
-- Encourage more newsstands, coffee shops and food vendors. Eliminate or tightly regulate the sale of "knock-off" merchandise on the streets. ETA: Following up on Terminus' post, if the street vendors can't be controlled then eliminate them.
Bill Campbell will be out of prison in a year or two. Since he did such a great job with the street vendors in 1996, put him in charge of this project.;)

[greg30127]

I think it's important that if Atlanta did fountains or sculptures or even beautified ramps (I like the idea of something to create a kind of "district" feel apart from adding placard to street signs) it be QUALITY -- not the typical suburban, corporate crap that, unfortunately, is so common in Atlanta. That's why I emphasize "artistically significant"; we don't need more McFountains, McMonuments, McParks that only suitably complement the World of Coke. Better just to build more Home Depots than settle for more half-assed garbage.


I just saw this comment so late to reply.

I would love to see more unique fountain and water features in the area, but not sure how you can get around the "bum factor" with them. I mean, look at that really nice fountain just off of Peachtree at Five Points across from the park - the wall of water built for the Olympics that is about 40 feet wide. Every time I go down there, at least 3-4 bums are sleeping on the sitting area, and many times there are street preachers with fold out chairs preaching to people right in front of it as well. Hardly makes you want to walk up and enjoy it.

Maybe install some of those zapper pads in the seating area of any new fountains? If you sit on them longer than 10 minutes - ZAP! :rolleyes:

[ATLaffinity]

I would love to see more unique fountain and water features in the area, but not sure how you can get around the "bum factor" with them.

kill two birds with one stone...

Roundabouts with fountains

i honestly think it's unethical to not convert lethal intersections into roundabouts

i bet there's intersections in ATL that see deaths from red lights run year after year. totally eliminated with a roundabout.

make it illegal for pedestrians to walk to the center with the fountain and bum problem is solved.:tup:

The Economist on rise of roundabouts in US (http://economist.com/world/na/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9621685)

[MarketsWork]

I would love to see more unique fountain and water features in the area, but not sure how you can get around the "bum factor" with them. I mean, look at that really nice fountain just off of Peachtree at Five Points across from the park - the wall of water built for the Olympics that is about 40 feet wide. Every time I go down there, at least 3-4 bums are sleeping on the sitting area, and many times there are street preachers with fold out chairs preaching to people right in front of it as well. Hardly makes you want to walk up and enjoy it.

That is purely a failure of policing, and a product of indifference by the City. Homeless shelters should not be so close to Atlanta's convention and tourist areas anyway, but since they are, the police should vigorously enforce all loitering and pandhandling laws to the very letter. As the beat cops used to say, "Move along, pal." Allowing loitering bums to ruin our public spaces is just fouling our own nest.

[gttx]

kill two birds with one stone...

Roundabouts with fountains

i honestly think it's unethical to not convert lethal intersections into roundabouts

i bet there's intersections in ATL that see deaths from red lights run year after year. totally eliminated with a roundabout.

make it illegal for pedestrians to walk to the center with the fountain and bum problem is solved.:tup:

The Economist on rise of roundabouts in US (http://economist.com/world/na/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9621685)

Interesting idea, though roundabouts certainly don't solve all the problems with traffic and accident-prevention, as you seem to suggest. The water feature in the center of a roundabout is certainly an excellent idea - see Rome's Piazza della Republica for a great example.

[Tombstoner]

I just saw this comment so late to reply.

I would love to see more unique fountain and water features in the area, but not sure how you can get around the "bum factor" with them. I mean, look at that really nice fountain just off of Peachtree at Five Points across from the park - the wall of water built for the Olympics that is about 40 feet wide. Every time I go down there, at least 3-4 bums are sleeping on the sitting area, and many times there are street preachers with fold out chairs preaching to people right in front of it as well. Hardly makes you want to walk up and enjoy it.

Maybe install some of those zapper pads in the seating area of any new fountains? If you sit on them longer than 10 minutes - ZAP! :rolleyes:

I think the bum factor is a problem with or without new fountains (I also like the space at Woodruff park and think it could be used better--why GSU police don't do more to make it a pleasant place is a mystery to me). As far as the preachers go...that doesn't bother me (as long as they don't start name-calling or being bigoted). It would be wonderful if Atlanta could develop a variation of a Speaker's Corner like they have in London where anyone with an idea/rant can say their piece. Of course 90% of people will be crackpots (worse than me! :D) and 99% of others in the park won't be listening, but it seems wonderfully democratic and something the MLK's city should be know for promoting.

[Tombstoner]

kill two birds with one stone...

Roundabouts with fountains

i honestly think it's unethical to not convert lethal intersections into roundabouts

i bet there's intersections in ATL that see deaths from red lights run year after year. totally eliminated with a roundabout.

make it illegal for pedestrians to walk to the center with the fountain and bum problem is solved.:tup:

The Economist on rise of roundabouts in US (http://economist.com/world/na/displaystory.cfm?story_id=9621685)

I like the idea of roundabouts in general, but it would be a shame to isolate really significant fountains on inaccessible traffic islands. Now, big, fairly nice (maybe neoclassical?) fountains (or monuments/statues) that basically just form a focal point of the roundabout is a good idea. But I think if you have a really special fountain, it is one that is going to beg interaction with the public. I can't say I think the Olympic Rings fountain in COP is anything to write home about, but I'll be damned if it doesn't make a lot of people happy--I go there to watch the people and not the fountain!.
The new fountain in Columbus Circle NYC is a nice example of a roundabout fountain that tries to be accessible, but I have to say, it scares the buhjezzes out of me.

[chubbydecker]

Is it just me or do others here find those little stop for pedestrian signs in the middle of the street annoying at best and a downright traffic hazzard at worst. Visitors from out of town who haven't seen these signs before are automatically stopping at them, even though no pedestrians are anywhere to be found. And the placement of these signs in the middle of the street are forcing motorists to shift several feet over to the right, often into the adjacent lane just to avoid hitting the signs.

[ATLaffinity]

Is it just me or do others here find those little stop for pedestrian signs in the middle of the street annoying at best and a downright traffic hazzard at worst. Visitors from out of town who haven't seen these signs before are automatically stopping at them, even though no pedestrians are anywhere to be found. And the placement of these signs in the middle of the street are forcing motorists to shift several feet over to the right, often into the adjacent lane just to avoid hitting the signs.
I'm worried about the first poor soul who expects an ATL driver to stop.

I "tested" the one on 10th near the Children's School.

I had my toddler (in a death grip) and I stepped out a bit and a police van (going nowhere) flew by going like 50. they had no intention of stopping, nor did the next 5 cars. eventually somebody stopped and everybody stopped. you just have to stand on the sidewalk and make feints towards the road until some driver "gets it".

here's how the first person is going to get killed:

car stops in one lane. waves people on. car comes in next lane.

i think they are deadly. i find it hard to believe somebody hasn't been killed yet.

[Dragonheart8588]

I'm worried about the first poor soul who expects an ATL driver to stop.

I "tested" the one on 10th near the Children's School.

I had my toddler (in a death grip) and I stepped out a bit and a police van (going nowhere) flew by going like 50. they had no intention of stopping, nor did the next 5 cars. eventually somebody stopped and everybody stopped. you just have to stand on the sidewalk and make feints towards the road until some driver "gets it".

here's how the first person is going to get killed:

car stops in one lane. waves people on. car comes in next lane.

i think they are deadly. i find it hard to believe somebody hasn't been killed yet.

There are a few of those on GSU campus. Thank Gods there are so many students walking there to make people actually stop.

[(four 0 four)]

For this to eventually 'catch on', people will have to assert their pedestrial rights. Be smart about it (don't just leap out) but you can't cower on the sidewalk and expect drivers to stop....its an education process that is likely to take some time.

[Andrea]

here's how the first person is going to get killed:

car stops in one lane. waves people on. car comes in next lane.

i think they are deadly. i find it hard to believe somebody hasn't been killed yet.

Interesting video on the PEDS page: http://www.peds.org/

[sprtsluvr8]

Is that ad going to air on network t.v.? I like the shock factor of it, but it has a toe across the line into bad taste in my opinion...

As a pedestrian in a designated crossing, I decide if an oncoming car is far enough away to stop without hitting me before I step out on the street. Then I keep watch out of the corner of my eye just to make sure the driver sees me, because all it takes is for the driver to glance away at anything for a second and then not have time to avoid hitting me. We all know as drivers that it can happen. There are millions of distractions - a commotion on the sidewalk, something hits your car, you change the radio, you spill something, etc. I think the pedestrian needs to be aggressive but stay guarded because there is a responsibility on both parties.

[Terminus]

Is it just me or do others here find those little stop for pedestrian signs in the middle of the street annoying at best and a downright traffic hazzard at worst. Visitors from out of town who haven't seen these signs before are automatically stopping at them, even though no pedestrians are anywhere to be found. And the placement of these signs in the middle of the street are forcing motorists to shift several feet over to the right, often into the adjacent lane just to avoid hitting the signs.

Those signs have increased driver compliance to stopping for pedestrians from around 5% to around 90% at unsignalized intersections where they have been solved (according to studies done by PEDS and the City of Atlanta). They are extremely succesful at improving pedestian safety.

There is no need for drivers to swerve to avoid them. If you do, you're obviously drivign well above the design speed for the street on which they are posted (or have some obscenely large concept of shy distance).

[Toxostoma Rufum]

Is it just me or do others here find those little stop for pedestrian signs in the middle of the street annoying at best and a downright traffic hazzard at worst. Visitors from out of town who haven't seen these signs before are automatically stopping at them, even though no pedestrians are anywhere to be found. And the placement of these signs in the middle of the street are forcing motorists to shift several feet over to the right, often into the adjacent lane just to avoid hitting the signs.

They're not annoying.
They're not a hazard.
Visitors from out of town can't drive worth a darn anyhow, so if it keeps one of them from hitting somebody, then good.
Motorists aren't shifting "several feet to the right" except in your mind.

Basically, I drive all over downtown and midtown nearly every day of the year, and I can't agree with you one bit.

Eventually, these signs work. But no, let's not try to use signs that are effective elsewhere because some people have never seen them before! Atlanta should be designed for urban living, not cater to country folk. They don't put Starbucks and WiFi all over rural Georgia to make things easier for city folk. ;)

[jason21atl]

Speaking as someone who lives in midtown and doesn't own a car, I wish there were MORE of these signs around the city. I find that in many cases, people just ignore them anyway and breeze right on through without slowing down. I've almost been mowed down on more than one occasion. We need some good Public Service Announcements to educate drivers on how to get along with pedestrians and who has the right of way in certain situations. ;-)

[gttx]

Those signs have increased driver compliance to stopping for pedestrians from around 5% to around 90% at unsignalized intersections where they have been solved (according to studies done by PEDS and the City of Atlanta). They are extremely succesful at improving pedestian safety.

There is no need for drivers to swerve to avoid them. If you do, you're obviously drivign well above the design speed for the street on which they are posted (or have some obscenely large concept of shy distance).

If the signs are correctly positioned in the middle of the road and you drive a normal size car, then they are not at all in the way.

If, on the other hand, someone has hit the sign and it's sticking into your lane (which is the case a lot), then you do need to move over to avoid it. Similarly, the egregious number of SUVs on the roads in-town cannot navigate around them without moving over. The real problem, then, is that people drive cars that are far too big and, often, drive too fast. People can blame the problem on the signs, but it would really just be avoiding the actual issue.

[alleystreetindustry]

it would be awesome if they could expand the zoo into something amazing. i don't have any problem with moving it. though the current location is what has defined zoo atlanta. i always thought a good place to have it was on the unused land north of piedmont park, but that space will turn around within the decade so that is a no.

interstate caps on the downtown connector is among the best ideas also. right now, all aerial shots of atlanta include this grey snake weaving itself through downtown and midtown. think of how beautiful it could look covered in parks. i prefer a green snake over a grey one any day.

[foxmccleod]

If the signs are correctly positioned in the middle of the road and you drive a normal size car, then they are not at all in the way.

If, on the other hand, someone has hit the sign and it's sticking into your lane (which is the case a lot), then you do need to move over to avoid it. Similarly, the egregious number of SUVs on the roads in-town cannot navigate around them without moving over. The real problem, then, is that people drive cars that are far too big and, often, drive too fast. People can blame the problem on the signs, but it would really just be avoiding the actual issue.

Does anyone know if there is somewhere we can go to request one of these pedestrian signs? I cross North at Myrtle almost daily, and with the distance between lights and the timing of the signals, it can be impossible to cross. Every now and then someone will be nice and stop, but with three lanes in each direction it is unusual to get all six clear.

[SWLong]

I would like to see all traffic lights that dangle on wires replaced with lights mounted on mast arms. That stuff hanging from wires strung across the streets is unsightly and inappropriate for Atlanta.

[Fiorenza]

Seems like it's slowly happening, but not fast enough. The Lenox Rd./Peachtree Rd. intersection has seen a little improvement, but the overhead wires are still there?? :(

[Andrea]

There's no money for it in Buckhead, Fiorenza,

[Rail Claimore]

Traffic signal assembly on spanwire, as opposed to mast arms, is very common in the eastern half of the country, even in wealthy states like those in New England.

Most western states, as well as Illinois and Wisconsin have their signals 99% on mast arms (with the exception of construction zones/temporary signals). There's money for it, somewhere.