LOS ANGELES | The Grand | FT(?) | 39 + 20 FLOORS

[LosAngelesSportsFan]

These are the most recent renders of Phase 1 (of 3). Gehry designed them and they will be across the street from Disney Hall. The first 4 picture will show the scope of the whole project, along with all three phases plus the park, and then the other two will show phase one. Following it is an article from today, June 11th, 2007

All Phases and Park

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http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a278/Imyurdada/civic_park.gif

Phase 1
http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a278/Imyurdada/30447026.jpg
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A Definite Frank Gehry Imprint

The new proposal for Grand Avenue’s first phase has the architect’s trademark loose forms. But will infighting drive him off the project?

By Christopher Hawthorne, Times Staff Writer

Since Frank Gehry was hired nearly two years ago to design a massive mixed-use project along Grand Avenue, he has clashed repeatedly and sometimes bitterly with the developer, New York's Related Cos. Barring some sudden rapprochement, it now seems unlikely that Gehry will return for the planned second and third phases of the project. But the plan, which the Los Angeles County Board of Supervisors will consider this morning, has turned a significant corner in recent weeks. The latest version suggests it will rise not only as an effective complement to Gehry's Walt Disney Concert Hall across the street but also as a dramatic architectural presence in its own right.

After bottoming out late last year, when models showed a pair of plain, rectangular office towers largely sealed off from the streets around them, the design has grown richer, more colorful and more reflective of Los Angeles and contemporary culture. The new design includes a pair of L-shaped towers playing energetically against each other — and against the rest of the downtown skyline — and framing a dense, multi-level retail plaza dotted with oak trees and other lush landscaping.

Some of the improvement is the natural result of the design gaining detail as it moves from concept toward groundbreaking this fall. But far more than previous versions, this one displays the loose, exuberant forms for which Gehry is known — and which, presumably, he was brought on to provide. Still, Gehry appears to be loosening his ties to the development. Reversing an earlier demand that his firm fully control the design of the first phase, he has agreed to let Dallas-based HKS Architects produce the final working drawings that will guide construction. His handpicked landscape architect, Laurie Olin, has left the project.

The architectural progress of the first phase, now budgeted at roughly $900 million, is a reminder that some of Gehry's best buildings, including the long-delayed Disney Hall, have been the result not just of sustained give-and-take between architect and client but also of substantial uncertainty. Far from a creative genius producing idiosyncratic forms in isolation, as he is sometimes portrayed, Gehry is an architect who thrives on drama and even brinksmanship. This project, from the beginning, has had no shortage of those elements; where they have been lacking, Gehry has sometimes worked to create them.

Although the budget for the first phase remains tight, it has loosened enough in recent months to allow the architect and his chief collaborator on the project, Craig Webb, a bit of creative wiggle room. The architects have given the taller, 48-story tower, which will contain a Mandarin Oriental Hotel along with a health club and high-end condominiums, more personality than it has shown since the earliest renderings. It is now cloaked in an undulating façade of mirrored glass that at several points pulls away dramatically from a boxy structural shell underneath.


The taller tower draws some inspiration from the
two mirrored glass skyscrapers at nearby Califor-
nia Plaza. (Gehry Partners, LLP)

In shaping the tower, Gehry and Webb say they are reaching back in part to the skyscraper designs of Kevin Roche, particularly Roche's U.N. Plaza, finished in 1975 on the east side of Manhattan. But the inspiration is also local. The tower design represents an architectural bridge between Disney Hall and the two mirrored-glass skyscrapers that make up Arthur Erickson's nearby California Plaza. This sense of local connection — an idiosyncratic spin on the idea of architectural context — is precisely what's missing in other Related projects, such as the Time Warner Center in Manhattan. For Gehry, the most effective kind of contextualism is surprising and energetic rather than dutiful — riffing on nearby buildings instead of copying them. That's the approach he's taken here, and it will make the tower — if built in its present form — the most compelling vertical form on the downtown skyline.

The guidelines of the Community Redevelopment Agency, however, include a recommendation against using any kind of reflective glass, which can cause glare. (Gehry ran into problems with glare at Disney Hall.) Yet strange as it might sound, given the banal reputation of the material, losing the mirrored glass would be a significant setback at this stage architecturally. At the same time, the architects have made the smaller, 24-story tower, which will hold a mixture of market-rate and subsidized apartments, more distinct in its own right, adding fixed window boxes to its facades along 1st and Olive streets. The boxes, which Gehry has used in European projects, would help give some character and life to the outside of the tower.

Perhaps the most surprising new element in new models is the decorative pattern that Gehry has added to the tower facades overlooking the plaza — the inside faces of each L. The pattern would take the lush landscaping growing out of the retail pavilions and, as a visual motif, extend it vertically into the sky. It could connect the project not only to the history of murals downtown but also to the nascent revival of ornament in the architecture and design worlds. The pattern, a floral design blown up to skyscraper scale, is something of a placeholder and needs refinement.

The idea of pulling the landscaping up into the air is topped off, literally, in the current design by live oak trees on the roofs of both towers. Though Gehry says he isn't aware of the reference, the gesture recalls the medieval Guinigi Tower, in the Italian town of Lucca, which is also crowned by spreading oak trees. With Olin having left the project, the job of refining those and other landscape elements has fallen to Nancy Goslee Power, who runs a landscape firm in Santa Monica and collaborated a decade ago with Gehry on the renovation of the Norton Simon Museum in Pasadena. Related officials insist Power's job will be to flesh out, not recast, Olin's scheme.

At the plaza level, meanwhile, the design has made significant progress. Behind the free-standing retail pavilions along Grand rises a dense multi-level collection of shops and terraces. This effectively creates a kind of urban hillside: a third architectural presence with enough height and size to compete with the towers on either side. At sidewalk level along 1st, 2nd and Olive streets, the models now show a loosely stacked collection of geometric forms. Large, brightly colored concrete panels (where other Related projects might use impressive-looking stone) alternate with expanses of glass and punched-through openings for pedestrians or cars. The retail pavilions themselves, topped with colored-glass sunshades, suggest a dense interplay between closed-off and open-air spaces, between informality and refinement.

It's still not clear which retailers will fill those pavilions. Related has been hoping that an Apple computer store will occupy the most important retail corner, at Grand Avenue and 1st Street. But Related and Gehry say Steve Jobs, Apple's chief executive, is interested in putting the same kind of sleek cube on that corner that he has used for other high-profile Apple stores. Since Gehry hates that idea, Apple may wind up in another downtown development.

The overall design has yet to solve some of its most stubborn problems. It is not as open in the direction of Broadway — and, in general, to the south and east — as it should be. The façade along Olive Street is still getting the back-of-house treatment. On top of that, the diverse mixture of forms, materials and colors that Gehry is using here as a means of disguising the project's bulk remains something of a gamble. In general, Gehry's most successful recent designs have used a limited, monochromatic material palette — steel panels for Disney Hall, titanium for the Guggenheim Museum in Bilbao, Spain — to temper their energetic forms.

And with the details of the commercial block still consuming so much of Related's energy, planning for the project's 16-acre park, which will run downhill from the Music Center to City Hall, continues to lag. A team headed by Mark Rios, who has quietly taken the lead on the park, is expected to unveil a preliminary design this fall.

There are those in this city who lament that we've pinned too many of our collective hopes on the Grand Avenue development. Certainly it would be a mistake to expect that when it's built it will feel anything like the beating heart of Los Angeles, or, to borrow Eli Broad's phrase, like our Champs-Élysées. But the project has proven to be a fascinating measuring stick for the emerging public-private partnership model of urban development. It has provided a remarkable late-career test for the 78-year-old Gehry, who understands that it will help shape his legacy — particularly as an architect so closely associated with Los Angeles — but who has grown accustomed to generous budgets and deferential clients.

And it would be a mistake to reject outright the idea that a commercial plaza thick with pricey shops can tell us something meaningful about the future of shared space in this city. Los Angeles is familiar with the notion of playing out public life in the private realm: Look at Universal CityWalk, or the Grove. In that sense, compared with those retail projects or the aloof California Plaza, the Grand Avenue project represents at least a tentative step by commercial forces back in the direction of substantial engagement with cities and city-making. Gehry and Related deserve credit for gamely challenging the notion that high-end retail spaces have to embrace either an old-fashioned or a numbingly sleek form of urbanism.

The most important question going forward is how Related officials will judge the architecture of the first phase. They may view it as an encouraging sign of what real architecture can bring to a development, in buzz and urban character as well as in sales. But it's also possible that they'll see their tumultuous experience with Gehry primarily as a cautionary tale — a bullet dodged — and move forward convinced that the risks they have taken so far aren't worth repeating.

[BrandonJXN]

I want to see what the New Yorkers will say considering they have 2 large scale Gehry projects in the works (Beekman Tower and Atlantic Yards in Brooklyn).

I said in the LA Rundown thread that this tower is so ugly it's beautiful. You surely can't deny it's presense.

[NYC2ATX]

SOOOOO COOOL. Reminds me of the Hudson Yards project in Manhattan, and watch this one get started first too. :haha: That phase one looks awesome (yum, Frank Gehry), and the whole plan looks very promising. It's exciting. L.A. is going to be such a different and amazing mega-metropolis in 20 years or so. :tup: :D

[Thefigman]

I like this one a lot. Hope it is built as rendered above.

[3madjack]

It's like road-kill. You can't stop but stare.

From the rendering, looks like the scrap yard of old buildings and/or some of the abandoned buildings of Sao Paulo with Fred Flintstone homes at the base.

At least it's not a boring square box. It's growing on me but still it's sooooo odd.

[DJM19]

Well, it does seem like a lot of people will be actively around the building. This is not a structure you walk away from, it is curiosity in highrise form.

[samoen313]

for mr. gehry, this is like bush conservative. flat surfaces? limiting his bedazzling to a few classy undulating facades? a grandma's sunday best floral pattern painted loudly on the inner walls? chalk me up for "yes, i like it"

[BrandonJXN]

It's like road-kill. You can't stop but stare.


That's the truth. It's going to be sensory overload with the Disney Center and this gumbo of a building. The building alone will make people consider taking the steep hike up Bunker Hill.

:hyper:

[VA_Gentleman]

:previous: I was thinking the opposite. This fits in with the Disney concert hall and is a very interesting design. Even though I don't really like too much of Gehry's designs it is a lot more unique than the standard balconied condo towers sprouting up all over San Diego and Miami. And I hope this will help spur more development in downtown and keep away from further sprawl.

[JDRCRASH]

VA_Gentleman, I think the age of suburban sprawl may be coming to close already in Southern California!:banana:
I like the design of the Grand Avenue Project Phase 1. Its enviro-friendly!:D

But isn't the WHOLE project approved, not just phase 1?

[colemonkee]

The project scope, use, EIR and preliminary budgets are approved, not the designs. The designs for phases II and III don't exist yet in final form.

[JDRCRASH]

Thanks Colemonkee; you see I 'm just curious, because according to our site's resources as well as Emporis', SEVERAL high rises are being planned for the other Parcels included in the project.

[Stratosphere]

I said in the LA Rundown thread that this tower is so ugly it's beautiful. You surely can't deny it's presense.
Ugly? Look at that brownish tower in the picture. Now that's ugly.

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a278/Imyurdada/30449216.jpg

[colemonkee]

^ Are you talking about the Wells Fargo Center? I've always liked it. It's actually a red granite. It's not architecturally ground-breaking by any means, but it's subtly reminiscent of IM Pei's polygonal red granite tower at 6500 Wilshire, and it plays very well against the bright blue of California Plaza.

[WonderlandPark]

I agree with Colemonkey, always liked the two Wells Fargo complex (2) towers, with the red granite. Not the best in downtown LA (Gas Company is probably my fave), but they work well on Bunker Hill with the silver glass across the street in California Plaza. There is a lot worse to be found in LA.

[LAmetroman]

Wells Fargo has always been one of my favorites also. I think it has and will continue to age gracefully.

Does anyone think the last batch of renderings make the project appear to be turning its back to the park, civic center, and the historic core? Unless you are visiting the music center or working in one of the adjacent office towers, one seems to be viewing very unattractive facades.

Why does the "iconic" tower have to be L shaped? Previous massing models had the signature curving facades on all four sides. What was wrong with that?

Can I have Cal Plaza III now and wait 5-10 years for Grand Avenue?:)

[JDRCRASH]

^ ^ ^

As far as we anybody knows, 3 California Plaza is still dead, unless some developer revives it.

[BrandonJXN]

I agree with Colemonkey, always liked the two Wells Fargo complex (2) towers, with the red granite. Not the best in downtown LA (Gas Company is probably my fave), but they work well on Bunker Hill with the silver glass across the street in California Plaza. There is a lot worse to be found in LA.

Wells Fargo Plaza are awesome for the sole reason that they change shape.

Together they are two broad triangular buildings:
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/photopost/data/503/103wellsfargo.jpg

Other times, they are just boxes:
http://img43.photobucket.com/albums/v133/RafflesCity/ROT/wfla.jpg

And the other, they can appear competely flat:
http://mywebpage.netscape.com/sscpicsmcc/la35.jpg

[BigDan35]

This was in the newspaper today. I read the article on it. It says that it was approved 4-1 and construction should begin in October.

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

Angelenic.com is has the latest scoop on the upcoming ground-breaking dates for these towers:

grand avenue project work begins december 3
by rico on November 27, 2007

After years of planning, delays and complicated teamwork from numerous architects, developers, construction companies, local governments and the resident community, site abatement work on Phase I of the Frank Gehry-designed Grand Avenue Project is confirmed to begin Monday, December 3.

The angelenic team was contacted by Related Companies’ Najla Kayyem, VP of Marketing and Public Relations, with the latest information on the $2 billion development, the largest in Downtown and possibly the city.

If you’re anticipating demolition of the tinker-toy parking structure at 1st and Grand to begin early next week, you’ll have to wait just a little longer. Demolition activity — as well as the accompanying star-studded groundbreaking ceremony —will coincide with the official February 7th ground-breaking date.

According to Ms. Kayyem, no “noticeable” work will occur on the Phase I parcel during the two-month abatement period, although cars will not be allowed to park in the structure. Abatement activities generally include soil sampling and demolition engineering. Actual details are still being worked out with the construction team but will be made available shortly.

The company will be debuting a new website for the development, which is being rebranded as “The Grand.” Though just a placeholder site at the moment, the finished product will go live in mid-December.

Funding for the civic park is in place and final plans are still being determined. The date for a public design review will be set in early December.
The park is an integral component of Related’s development, as the Grand Avenue Project’s Phase I certificate of occupancy will not be granted until the new green space is completed.

Project details for Phase I entail 1.3 million square feet of new construction, including a Mandarin Oriental Hotel, Equinox Fitness, mixed-income housing, retail space, 1,400 parking spaces and major streetscape improvements.

Photos of the site’s current tinker-toy parking structure viewable here and here. see http://www.angelenic.com/downtown-general/grand-avenue-project-work-begins-december-3/#more-204 for pics.

[bayrider]

Why do developers insist on hiring Gehry?

[Stratosphere]

Why do developers insist on hiring Gehry?
Maybe because his achitectural firm is based in LA and maybe because they like the Walt Disney Concert Hall across the street?

[mayhem]

That is hideous.

[BrandonJXN]

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1171/1466071909_34b71ae716_b.jpg

Youu know, Bunker Hill is the Acropolis of Downtown Los Angeles and this project could very well be it's 'Parthenon.'

[Quixote]

Why do developers insist on hiring Gehry?

It's only for the first phase.

[Quixote]

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2291/2084622545_ffd76ffe4c_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2284/2085428098_8530fb355d_b.jpg

Work Begins At Grand Avenue Project Site

By Rico
December 3, 2007

Though demolition won’t occur until February 7th’s groundbreaking event, today marks a historic point in the evolution of Downtown Los Angeles. The tinker-toy parking structure on the site of the Grand Avenue Project “The Grand” is now closed to vehicles, and a green construction fence surrounds the lot.

Site activities over the next two months will include soil sampling, demolition engineering, geological testing and construction coordination. Jurors, government employees and tourists should take the subway to the Civic Center metro station or be prepared to research alternative parking options beforehand.

The Related Cos. (http://www.related.com/index.asp?model=homeRelated&view=1&companyid=7) is developing the Frank Gehry-designed project. More photos of the project site here (http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=grand+avenue+project&w=11342685%40N00&s=rec).

Previous coverage and project details (http://www.angelenic.com/downtown-general/grand-avenue-project-work-begins-december-3/).

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2095/2085412614_78a7d7e0b1_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2043/2085421080_69e3fe1723_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2293/2085432930_9b37aedd81_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2061/2084633027_63c48c8b5d_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2117/2085423896_7b776a652c_b.jpg

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Source: angelenic: downtown los angeles (http://www.angelenic.com/downtown-general/work-begins-at-grand-avenue-project-site/)

[edluva]

Why do developers insist on hiring Gehry?

because he's marketable to the idiot masses and he's the best this soul-less nation can muster.

[Quixote]

$3 Billion Predicament: Grand Avenue Project Delayed

By Rich Alossi
January 11, 2008

The $3 billion Grand Avenue Project (http://www.thegrandla.com/), being developed by New York-based Related Cos., has been delayed. Official groundbreaking is being pushed back to summer at the earliest, according to a company representative we spoke with today.

Site prep work continues (http://www.angelenic.com/downtown-general/tinker-toy-parking-garage-disassembly-begins/), however, as the tinkertoy structure is being tested for demolition engineering purposes.

The official word on the delay is that “some key folks had conflicts with the timing.” Key folks, eh?

Blogdowntown recently reported (http://blogdowntown.com/blog/3044) on the Concrete Frequency (Chttp://www.calendarlive.com/music/classical/cl-ca-concrete30dec30,0,2061653.story) symposium with Frank Gehry, designer of the project’s first phase, in which the outspoken architect openly criticized the project’s funding. Gehry contends that “Money is not available and the developer is in denial.” This would seem to fit in perfectly with Mr. Gehry’s allegation.

With an unsteady market and construction costs that have climbed by over $1 billion since last year, this latest delay is unfortunate but hardly a surprise. However, it’s regrettable that Downtown has to pay the price of keeping another deadzone in our still-struggling Civic Center.

Previous Coverage

-Work Begins at Grand Avenue Project Site (http://www.angelenic.com/downtown-general/work-begins-at-grand-avenue-project-site/)
-New Grand Avenue Renderings (http://www.angelenic.com/downtown-general/new-grand-avenue-renderings/)

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Source: angelenic (http://www.angelenic.com/downtown-general/3-billion-predicament-grand-avenue-project-delayed/)

[BigDan35]

I just can't help but to think, LA has some major issues. I've said it before but it's true. Whereas other big cities are moving forward with a ton of highrises, LA is just stuck. Seems like every big project we have, is either trying to get approval, or is approved, yet delayed. I'm so sick of hearing about delays and I hear about it in LA more than anywhere else.

[JDRCRASH]

I totally agree. It shouldn't be this hard to urbanize Downtown, regardless if we are an earthquake-prone area or not.

The approval process here is a joke.

[DaveofCali]

I just can't help but to think, LA has some major issues. I've said it before but it's true. Whereas other big cities are moving forward with a ton of highrises, LA is just stuck. Seems like every big project we have, is either trying to get approval, or is approved, yet delayed. I'm so sick of hearing about delays and I hear about it in LA more than anywhere else.

I feel the same way too. It seems that all the other world cities and many of America's big cities are passing by L.A. in terms of urban development. L.A. seems to be a far cry now from the "city of the future" as it was called before.

L.A. wasn't like this before. Just 18 years ago, L.A. was having tons of skyscraper development, dramatically changing downtown L.A.'s skyline.

[aaron38]

I usually just ignore deconstructivism, hoping the ego trip fad will go away, but this is worse than usual.

The towers themselves actually aren't horrible, but what is that caveman/tree fort/junkyard base? Do starchitects realize what their designs look like to "normal" people?

[DJM19]

We can only hope it was just not fully thought through at that point. I doubt Related would stand for it to be left like that.

[Raraavis]

I am not a Gehry fan but it will be a very unique and interesting place with his concert hall and buildings together. It will look like no other place on earth.

[JDRCRASH]

What is sad is that anti-urbanizationists seem to use the "Historical Landmark" ordinance often for the WRONG reason as an excuse not to build taller. Because of that, our skyline is crooked in places where it shouldn't be!
Only a few blocks away from the tallest building are single story structures that are declared "Historical Landmarks"!

It pisses me off!:pissed:

[Raraavis]

What is sad is that anti-urbanizationists seem to use the "Historical Landmark" ordinance often for the WRONG reason as an excuse not to build taller. Because of that, our skyline is crooked in places where it shouldn't be!
Only a few blocks away from the tallest building are single story structures that are declared "Historical Landmarks"!

It pisses me off!:pissed:

Let's preserve a little of our history. With the possible exception of Hong Kong or certain portions of New York City, I have yet to see a city that did not have lots of non-historic parking lots, single story and low-rise buildings that could be torn down for new high rises. When our cities are full of 60 story buildings all the way out to the suburbs then we can consider destroying historic buildings for new development.

[JDRCRASH]

I have no problem with preserving buildings; it's important to preserve icons such as the "Felix the Cat" sign; it's when they get out of hand is when I don't like it.

They need to get creative, like creating a little a historic park completely surrounding the sign.

Or look at the new enviro-friendly Foster Biulding in New York City; they built the structure above the existing Historic building!!! I could never have thought of that!:D

[Plompy Lfeata]

this stuff is aweful, i feel bad for LA having to deal with a toy land looking ugly bunch of weird buildings.

[RuFFy]

WWW.LA.CURBED.COM


Related: Grand Avenue's Work Schedule Hasn't Changed
Thursday, January 17, 2008, by Dakota

2008.01.grandrep.jpg Today, LAist.com posted on Grand Avenue, citing those negative comments made by Frank Gehry and the ground-breaking push back news. We asked Related's press rep for an update on the project, and specifically asked about the ground-breaking push back. Here's their statement: "The preliminary date for a groundbreaking ceremony is being revised due to the personal schedules of several key participants. The project’s work schedule hasn’t changed. We still plan to begin demolition of the garage in February.

"The schedule of the groundbreaking is symbolic and built around availability of multiple participants. It has little to do with the actual schedule. The total construction schedule is still about 45 months from now, and that hasn’t changed.”
· Nobody holds a press conference when it's bad news [LAist.com]

[Spocket]

What a terrible, terrible looking building. Maybe if they got rid of the multi-coloured puke all over it or decided to change the massing in some way it would be a better project. Right now though, according to the renderings, that's the kind of building that people are going to mistake for a run-down rat's nest two years after it's built.

[JDRCRASH]

Well, the designs haven't been finalized, so it may alter itself gradually.

[Dale]

Well, the designs haven't been finalized, so it may alter itself gradually.

That's what they always say about Gehry buildings. :cool:

[Quixote]

Grand Avenue Groundbreaking Delayed

Developer Says $3 Billion Project Still on Schedule, With First Phase to Open in 2011

By Anna Scott

A groundbreaking ceremony for the $3 billion Grand Avenue project has been pushed back from March until at least the summer, officials with developer Related Cos. confirmed last week. It marks the third time that the public kickoff for the massive Bunker Hill effort has been postponed.

However, Related Cos. President Bill Witte said the development is on track to meet its most recently announced timeline, with phase one slated for completion in 2011. He also maintained that the project's financing is in order.

"The groundbreaking is more of a symbolic event," Witte told Los Angeles Downtown News last week. "It has little to do with where we are in the project schedule. We are continuing ahead, and we have the wherewithal to do it."

Designed by architect Frank Gehry, the 3.6 million-square-foot development - dubbed The Grand - is expected to eventually bring 2,600 housing units, 449,000 square feet of retail, a hotel, a grocery store and a health club to Downtown Los Angeles.

The approximately $1 billion, 1.3 million-square-foot first phase of the development will include a 48-story Mandarin Oriental Hotel & Residences with 295 rooms and 266 for-sale units, a 19-story residential tower with 126 market-rate apartments and 98 affordable units, a 250,000-square-foot retail pavilion and 16-acre civic park. The towers will rise across from Walt Disney Concert Hall on the site of a current multi-level parking lot.

Related initially set the groundbreaking for October 2007, but subsequently moved it to the end of the year. As that date neared, developers said that the ceremony would take place by March. That was recently amended to an unspecified date in the summer.

The repeated delays have led some in the real estate industry to speculate that the project is facing financial uncertainty. That comes amid the nationwide credit crunch and a softening of the housing market.

"These ceremonies are important on a number of levels," said a Downtown figure experienced in large projects, who asked to remain anonymous because he did not want to publicly criticize another development. "If you're not quite there with your funding, it's often far too risky to state that you're going to start. You don't want to take the financial hit if you have to scale back your project in any way."

Marty Collins, CEO and president of Gatehouse Capital Corp., developer of the under-construction $600 million hotel, retail and condominium complex W Hollywood Hotel and Residences, agreed that for large-scale projects, construction financing is typically in place before holding a groundbreaking ceremony.

But, he said, a groundbreaking delay could also reflect various considerations beyond the construction schedule. "Historically, groundbreakings have been events that are tied to the commencement of construction," Collins said, "but more recently, these are largely ceremonial marketing events."

Despite the delays, Witte maintains that the project is financially stable.

"The most important part of these deals is equity, which we anticipate to be 25% to 30% of the cost" for phase one, he said. "That is in place. As we begin site work, we will then get a construction loan to provide the balance of the financing. The issues in today's markets are not construction loans per se, but rather the equity that underpins them. As far as we are concerned, we have the necessary financing in place."

Securing that remaining funding in the slowing market, however, could come with additional hurdles, said Jack Kyser, senior vice president and chief economist for the Los Angeles County Economic Development Corp.

"They are in a somewhat unusual spot," Kyser said of Related Cos. "Right now, you have a financial system that has almost completely seized up. There is so much fear of risk, they are probably going to leap over higher hurdles."

Still, he added, the developer is probably in a better position than most.

"Related has a track record." Kyser said. "They will probably get their funding, but they're going to burn a little more midnight oil than they planned on."

Staying the Course

Despite the uncertainty in the real estate industry - including in Downtown, where several condominium projects have slowed or changed course to rental units - Witte said there are no plans to downsize or alter The Grand.

"Nobody who's in real estate today isn't somewhat concerned about the environment," said Witte, "but I do believe that even in this climate, Downtown is faring as good or better than other sub-markets. The way things have played out, we would rather be where we are than opening at the end of '08. We also know that we are getting very, very strong responses for an incredibly high-caliber level of retail and restaurants. We're doing better than we thought we might."

Last month, Related began lead paint abatement on the parking garage at Grand Avenue and First Street, which the company expects to demolish on schedule next month, Witte said. Construction on the $50 million park is expected to begin in the fall, with the opening slated for 2010. The hotel and retail pavilion are scheduled to debut in early 2011, and the residential towers are anticipated to open that summer.

In the meantime, Ninth District Councilwoman Jan Perry, who has been closely involved in the plan's development, said that any speculation about the project potentially changing course is "premature."

"I think most projects built in this city of this magnitude always experience bumps in the road," said Perry, who noted that Related paid for the park up front. "This is not a situation that is unusual."

Related will likely hold off on setting a specific date for the groundbreaking ceremony until demolition of the parking garage is complete, Witte said.

"Because this is such a protracted schedule, we want to be really into the ground-up construction before the groundbreaking," said Witte. He added, "If we start and there's a two-month delay, you'll all be calling again, asking what's going on.

"No matter what we do, we assume that we're going to get questions about the status of the project until we're finished."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Los Angeles Downtown News (http://www.downtownnews.com/articles/2008/01/21/news/news01.txt)

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

Grand Avenue Designs Approved

Related Cos. One Step Closer to Securing Phase One Financing

by Anna Scott
http://www.downtownnews.com/articles/2008/03/03/news/news04.txt

The Grand Avenue plan took a small step forward Monday, Feb. 25, when city, county and redevelopment officials approved updated designs for the first phase of the Bunker Hill mega-development. The move allows developer Related Cos. to move forward with seeking an estimated $600 million-plus construction loan.


"It's a necessary milestone for us," said Related of California President Bill Witte.

Plans for phase one of the $3 billion, Frank Gehry-designed project, dubbed The Grand, call for a 48-story Mandarin Oriental Hotel & Residences with 295 rooms and 266 condominiums, a 19-story residential tower with 126 market-rate apartments and 98 affordable units, 250,000 square feet of retail, an Equinox health club, a nightclub and a 16-acre civic park. Completion is expected in 2011.

Designs had previously been approved for phase one, but the new documents provide a more detailed picture of the project.

"We've gone in and we've designed all of the materials of the façades - glass, stone, etc. - to a very high level of specificity that's ready for detailing," said Brian Aamoth of Gehry Partners, who displayed slides during last Monday's meeting of the Grand Avenue Authority. In addition to identifying materials, the new documents define the buildings' exterior volumes and interior layouts.

During his presentation, Aamoth highlighted the planned multi-level landscaping, terraces and open space with canopies to create shading between the two towers, as well as plans for retail and entrances on multiple sides of the project.

"What would normally be considered the back side of the project, we don't treat as the back side," said Aamoth. "We've taken advantage of all sides of the project to create a porous and active project."

Aamoth also touched on The Grand's relationship to Walt Disney Concert Hall, another Gehry-designed effort, which stands across from the development site.

"In a sense, the way that Disney Hall has a large hall and smaller pieces, we've sort of taken that design approach on this project," Aamoth said. Pointing out the diagonal placement of the two towers, surrounded and linked by smaller structures housing commercial components, he said, "Our intent was to break down the monolithic scale."

The documents presented Monday focused on the structural elements of The Grand. Developers are expected to bring detailed plans for landscaping and art inclusions to the Grand Avenue Authority on June 1.


The new specifications will inform the project's construction documents, expected to total more than 1,000 pages, which help determine building costs and how much is needed in a construction loan.

In December, Related began lead paint abatement on a multi-level parking structure at Grand Avenue and First Street, where the towers will rise. The company expects to demolish the structure by the end of this month, after its new phase one equity partner - Istithmar, a sovereign fund controlled by the royal family of Dubai - is approved by the Community Redevelopment Agency, the County Board of Supervisors and the Grand Avenue Authority.

Last week, Los Angeles Downtown News broke the news that Istithmar had committed to joining Related after the previous partner, California Public Employees' Retirement System, and its investment manager MacFarlane Partners, pulled out.

Istithmar has committed $100 million to the project, which Witte says he expects to account for about 40% of the total equity. Another partner, the Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group, has committed $42 million with another $20 million expected, Witte said. Related will take responsibility for the balance, he said, "and we may elect to bring in another partner."

Related currently has almost $90 million invested in The Grand. The developer previously predicted its total equity cost would be approximately $300 million, which Witte says was a "rounded up" figure.

A formal groundbreaking is slated for the summer.


http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2238/2301923598_882e7f8f4b_o.jpg


The latest designs for the Grand Avenue project were presented and approved last week. The first phase of the Frank Gehry-designed development is scheduled to open in 2011.
Renderings courtesy of Related of California

[JDRCRASH]

This is a positive step forward.

[Quixote]

Grand Avenue Partners Get First Approval

News Brief

The Community Redevelopment Agency board last Thursday approved developer Related Companies' new key equity partner, Istithmar - an investment fund controlled by the royal family of Dubai - in the first phase of its $3 billion Grand Avenue project. Los Angeles Downtown News last month was the first to report that Related joined with Istithmar after a previous partner, California Public Employees' Retirement System, and its investment manager MacFarlane Partners, pulled out of the Bunker Hill project officially known as The Grand. A third investor, the Mandarin Oriental Hotel Group, was also approved Thursday. Related of California President Bill Witte has said that Istithmar has committed $100 million to the project, expected to account for about 40% of the initial equity. Mandarin Oriental has committed $42 million with another $20 million expected, while Related will assume responsibility for the balance and may bring in another partner. The new partnership must also be approved by the County Board of Supervisors and the Grand Avenue Authority, expected to happen by the end of this month. Once approvals are complete, Related can move forward with demolishing a multi-level parking structure at First Street and Grand Avenue. The developer is also in the process of finalizing the project's construction documents, a necessary step before securing the estimated $600 million-plus construction loan. Phase one of The Grand, designed by Frank Gehry, will feature a 48-story Mandarin Oriental Hotel & Residences with 295 rooms and 266 condominiums, a 19-story residential tower with 126 market-rate apartments and 98 affordable units, 250,000 square feet of retail, an Equinox health club, a nightclub and a 16-acre civic park. Completion is expected in 2011.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Los Angeles Downtown News (http://www.downtownnews.com/articles/2008/03/10/news/news_briefs/at01.txt)

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

I was under the impression that this was the final approval of investors needed. But it sound like we need to wait until the end of the month before the project can move forward.

[JDRCRASH]

^

It appears so:

"Related will assume responsibility for the balance and may bring in another partner."

[Quixote]

Funding Puts Grand Avenue Plan in Starting Position

With $100 million from a Dubai fund, construction of the massive mixed-use development in downtown Los Angeles will begin next month, officials say.

By Cara Mia DiMassa, Los Angeles Times Staff Writer
March 18, 2008

Armed with $100 million from Dubai and a refined design plan, officials Monday said construction will finally begin next month on the Frank Gehry-designed residential and shopping plaza along Grand Avenue that is considered a linchpin to downtown L.A.'s revitalization.

The announcement comes after months of delays and questions about the viability of such a massive development in the midst of L.A.'s real estate slump.

But those doubts were eased significantly Monday when the government agency overseeing the redevelopment approved the investment of Istithmar, a fund controlled by the royal family of Dubai.

The fund stepped in with $100 million after one of Grand Avenue's big early investors, California Public Employees' Retirement System, exited the project, saying the organization was already too heavily invested in the downtown real estate market.

The investment from Dubai gives the developer, Related Cos., the money needed to secure construction loans -- allowing it to finally tear down a parking structure across from the Walt Disney Concert Hall, where the first phase of the development will be built. The $2-billion plan calls for shops, condo towers and a boutique hotel -- as well as a civic park -- on city and county land on Bunker Hill.

"There will always be challenges on this project." said Bill Witte, chief executive of Related California, which is overseeing the project. "But we feel very good about where it is now."

Construction was expected to begin last fall, but the time required for design development and project approvals caused delays.

A lot is riding on the project. Grand Avenue is seen by downtown boosters as a way to bring night life and an upscale feel to the city center.

Russell Brown, president of the Downtown Los Angeles Neighborhood Council and executive director of the Historic Downtown business improvement district, said he had been hearing for months concerns that Grand Avenue was in trouble.

"But any large project takes a while to work things through," Brown said. "In many ways, these haven't been routine delays. To be able to go through those hurdles, in spite of that uncertainty, expresses a great amount of confidence in downtown, and in L.A. I think it's going to be an amazing event."

Craig Webb of Gehry Partners said details of the project were fleshed out from the initial schematic design. Those refinements, he said, included figuring out the facades of the project's two towers, doorway locations and stonework patterns -- "pretty specific stuff."

The towers -- which would house residences as well as a Mandarin Oriental hotel -- would be "skinned" with a combination of glazing, stone and precast concrete.

In addition, Webb said, "we've been working on the interiors of the apartments, getting into very fine details about the kitchens and the bathrooms -- all the stuff that makes a building go together. The full building from top to bottom."

Now, Webb said, another firm will take the designs and translate them into thousands of pages of construction documents.

Two aspects of the design -- the landscaping and public art components -- are still in the works, Witte said. He said he expected the Grand Avenue Authority, which is made up of city and county leaders, to consider those elements in May.

Plans for a public park that is part of the project's first phase are also in the initial stages. Officials hope to unveil a proposed schematic design for the park at a meeting in late April, where they also plan to discuss how the park will be operated and programmed. Witte said he expected construction to begin on the park this year.

There remain skeptics who wonder whether downtown L.A. is being overdeveloped with condo projects. In addition to Grand Avenue, there are a slew of residential towers rising around Staples Center, a 76-story tower proposed next to Pershing Square and other older office buildings being renovated for apartments.

In the last year, about a third of all proposed housing developments downtown have been put on hold or canceled. They include the 50-story Zen tower on 3rd and Hill streets, the Mill Street Lofts in the industrial district, the multitower Metropolis off the 110 Freeway and the conversion of the former Herald Examiner building.

At the meeting Monday, some officials noted downtown's changing landscape.

"We need to continue to wish ourselves good luck," said L.A. County Supervisor Gloria Molina.

The three-phase Grand Avenue project ultimately could include eight condo and office towers, retail stores, a boutique hotel and public park. The first phase includes two towers at opposite ends of the block east of Disney Concert Hall -- set that way to preserve sightlines to the venue from many parts of downtown. The taller tower -- 48 stories -- would include rooftop pools, 264 high-end condo units, a 289-room Mandarin Oriental and an Equinox health club.

The second, 19-story tower would include nearly 100 rental units -- designated as affordable housing -- and 126 condominiums. Phase one also includes the civic park northeast of the concert hall.

The second phase is to be built on the block south of Disney Hall, with preliminary plans calling for two 30- to 35-story residential towers, one five- to six-story residential building and more retail stores and parking. The third phase would go two blocks east of the concert hall. Preliminary plans call for a 35- to 40-story residential building that would include some retail shops and possibly a 15- to 20-story building with office space or condos.

Brown said he had recently returned from Bilbao, Spain, where he saw the Frank Gehry-designed Guggenheim Museum and a trolley system built throughout the city. Brown, who has been working on a similar street car system for Los Angeles, said the trip convinced him of "the extent to which significant architecture and public spaces can really revitalize whole city centers."

He predicted that the public park and Grand Avenue's retail spaces, which could potentially include a gym, bookstore and grocery store, "will start to pull together parts of the community on the northern part of downtown that have never been there before."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Los Angeles Times (http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-grand18mar18,1,364431.story)

[JDRCRASH]

I'm glad; looks like we MIGHT break ground on schedule this time.

[Quixote]

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3214/2436004166_fc2168c817_b.jpg
Kathleen McMullin asks a question about the park model.

Presented Park Plan a Start, but Illustrates the Need for a Cohesive Transit System

By Eric Richardson
April 22, 2008

County Supervisor Gloria Molina welcomed the crowd gathered to hear of plans for a redone Civic Center park with a warning: dreaming is nice, but at the end of the day something's got to be built with the money the project has in hand.

Her remarks set the tone for a meeting that lacked grand reveals, and instead talked of building a basic foundation onto which pieces could be added as additional funds were raised. Given the lack of architectural fireworks, programming that included large events was given a prominent placement.

Though neither were addressed, the presentation's focus on crowds illustrated how vital both the streetcar and Regional Connector will be to the park's success.

The Civic Center park sits tucked away between government buildings, running from the Music Center on the west to City Hall on the east. With the 101 freeway a significant barrier to its north, the park isn't naturally at the center of anything. While the Grand Avenue Project will bring residential development a block away, the bulk of Downtown's residents aren't within an easy walk of the park site.

Those who want to come to the park to read a book, eat at the cafe or throw around a frisbee will have to find their way to the site. The proposed streetcar system, in its role as a "walk extender," offers the best potential to make the park somewhere that residents will visit. Without it, the space's location quickly becomes a deterrent to casual use.

Large events will draw a crowd from beyond Downtown and bring their own set of challenges. The park flows down from the Music Center to City Hall with an emphasis on open views, creating an ideal space for concerts and rallies. In the process, though, the site crosses three major north-south streets: Spring, Broadway and Hill. All three are heavily used by bus lines.

A major event that extended through the park and led to the three streets' closure would currently cause a major disruption in transit traffic that travels through Downtown. A below-grade Regional Connector, as a second grade separated trunk line through Downtown, offers the ability for transit lines to run to the edges of the Central City.

Passengers headed across town would be able to transfer to the rail, sail under the disruption above, and reboard their bus on the other side. Alternatively, routes could simply bypass around Downtown, offering a connection to the rail system as a way to let those traveling into the core reach their destination.

All this, though, will take some time. Plans for the park have much to be finalized, and construction is tentatively scheduled for a Spring / Summer 2009 start and a mid-2011 conclusion.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2062/2436004822_761d5e766c_b.jpg
At Hill street the plan would leave current parking ramps intact, simply putting some green over top of them. Pedestrians would have to travel around the ramps, as they do today, disrupting a continuous flow down the middle of the site.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2172/2436004554_15918355ba_b.jpg
The enhanced park plan would re-activate the old State Building footprint, already once a park (http://blogdowntown.com/2008/04/3243-in-past-life-state-building-footprint-was). The basic plan would leave it in its current state.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Blogdowntown (http://blogdowntown.com/2008/04/3266-presented-park-plan-a-start-but-illustrates)

[Quixote]

Some more photos of the park model...

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3179/2436230197_5b2f1d91ac_o.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3069/2436229905_8e58d6093a_o.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3243/2436229495_f0482375f9_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2314/2437047616_7b71b61f1c_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2274/2436228269_1536f6c371_o.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2197/2436227847_bd95487465_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2113/2437034884_2248ed1e85_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3266/2436210895_f32d92e297_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3260/2437008032_eb04ccde45_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3073/2437007552_477792d004_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2358/2436188293_8b03a2b205_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3264/2436076593_93392aaa6c_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3198/2436072203_bc3091662e_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3039/2436067465_8c07feabef_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2327/2436877856_fbb40eae90_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2283/2436858370_2906f14b2b_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3112/2436035937_d4f008f21f_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3010/2436850616_a37870cd1f_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3133/2436029623_fbd6036c4b_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3257/2436025039_1f3979b5f2_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

And here are some photos of the Grand Avenue project model...

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2014/2436839370_2696fdf255_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3289/2436836052_d4f0d2e2b4_b.jpg
From Flickr, by alossix

[JDRCRASH]

The tower? I love it!:D

The Park?:no:

[Quixote]

Grand Avenue Park Price Could Rise

Developer and Officials Unveil Designs, Say 'Enhanced' Facility Would Surpass $50 Million

By Anna Scott

Developer Related Cos. and local officials last week unveiled initial designs of a proposed 16-acre Downtown Civic Park, part of Related's $3 billion Grand Avenue development. They also acknowledged that providing more than the most basic amenities could push the price tag well beyond the long discussed budget of $50 million.

Related and the county last week went to the state seeking $30 million in funds for the park project.

Hundreds of people milled around the light-filled mezzanine of the Dorothy Chandler Pavilion on the evening of Tuesday, April 22, and stayed well after dark to peruse models, view a presentation and discuss plans for the park that will stretch from the Music Center at Grand Avenue to City Hall at Spring Street.

In a twist, design firm Rios Clementi Hale Studios presented two options: A "base park," budgeted for the $50 million that Related Cos. has already paid (now $56 million, thanks to nearly $1 million in state funds and interest earned on the initial payment) and an "enhanced park," which would require an unspecified amount of additional funding.

Construction on the basic design is expected to begin next spring and wrap in summer 2011. The enhanced version, officials said, could unfold gradually as county and other officials secure more funding.

"We have a limited amount of money," said Second District County Supervisor and Grand Avenue Authority Chair Gloria Molina on Tuesday. "Let's plan a green space, a public park that is accessible to everyone... with the money we have."

While developers and officials stressed the constraints on plans for the park, critics said the money already in hand should be enough.

"Why are they even thinking about anything more than what they have the money to do?" asked Paul Novak, planning deputy for Fifth District Supervisor Mike Antonovich. "You've got a very speculative real estate project in a down economy with rising construction costs, all of which is being subsidized by taxpayers from Encino to Long Beach to Lancaster. That's a scary recipe."

A Park in Two Parts

The 3.6 million-square-foot, Frank Gehry-designed Grand Avenue project, officially known as The Grand, is expected eventually to bring 2,600 housing units, 449,000 square feet of retail, a hotel, a grocery store and a health club to Bunker Hill.

The approximately $1 billion first phase is slated for completion in 2011.

The Grand, which will rise on publicly owned land, is overseen by the Grand Avenue Authority, comprised of officials from the county, the city and the Community Redevelopment Agency. Related, fulfilling part of its agreement to develop The Grand, serves as project manager for the Civic Park.

Last Tuesday at the Dorothy Chandler Pavilion, near where the mega-development will rise, Mark Rios, a principal at Rios Clementi Hale, and programming consultant Mary McCue presented their proposals for the park.

The base plan is anchored by the existing Arthur J. Will Memorial Fountain, between the County Hall of Administration and the County Courthouse. It would be renovated and upgraded with features such as programmable pop-jets and dramatic lighting. The design also includes space for public art installations, lawns and gardens designed to host everything from farmer's markets to large concerts, a 3/4-mile pedestrian loop and a series of "sun gardens" and "shade gardens" along the northern and southern boundaries of the park, respectively.

The enhanced park features an open-air event pavilion decked out with colorful canopies at the center of the park, a pedestrian bridge spanning Broadway, improvements to surrounding sidewalks and additions such as extra gardens and a carousel.

While the $56 million currently available will cover the basic design, Related officials and the designers have said that ramps necessitated by the site's dramatic grade changes - 18 to 20 feet between blocks in some places - alone will cost $15 million, while equipping the park for large concerts is estimated at $5 million to $7 million.

Last week the county applied for $30 million in state funds for the Civic Park. Though no price tag on the enhanced park was revealed, Related officials said the grant would allow some elements of the design to be implemented.

Antonovich, an outspoken critic of taxpayer subsidies granted to The Grand's developers, abstained from voting on the grant application.

"I think the park grant application is really a precursor for the developer coming back to the city and county and asking for additional taxpayer subsidies for this project," said Novak. "It certainly tells us they're looking for more money."

Related of California President Bill Witte said he is confident that officials will be able to raise enough money to realize the enhanced design through donations, foundation funding and corporate sponsorship.

Mixed Reaction

Attendees of the design presentation included Downtown residents, workers and the merely curious. Reactions ran the gamut from impressed to underwhelmed.

"It's sort of boring to me. For a Grand Avenue project, it's not very grand," said Downtown Los Angeles Neighborhood Council President Russell Brown, though after hearing the presentation he conceded, "It's actually not as horrible as I initially projected it to be."

Brown's primary complaints, echoed by others, included a non-distinct architectural style even in the enhanced design, as well as a lack of integration with nearby public transportation.

Rios and McCue emphasized programming and activities as the key to the park, discussing large and intimate spaces, outdoor dining areas and restaurants, along with family-friendly events. "What we end up with is a park that needs to be about something," said Rios. "We want it to be a place that is about social engagement."

Others complimented the design. "They've basically laid out the infrastructure fine," said DLANC member and Downtown activist Brady Westwater, though he also voiced concerns about parking and transportation impacts.

Some were excited at the prospect of having a large park in Downtown Los Angeles. "I like it," said Nathan Johnston, 29, an accountant who lives a few blocks from Grand Avenue. "I'll be glad to see the parking lots go."

Local resident Brian Lin, 32, who works in admissions at USC, agreed, citing a growing and "glaring" need for family- and pet-friendly green space Downtown.

Ninth District Councilwoman and Grand Avenue Authority Vice Chair Jan Perry called the base park design "a good first cut." The next step, she said, should be to proceed with construction "and then see what we encounter."

Even if adjustments are made along the way, she said, "I think it's going to redefine Downtown in ways that people haven't even imagined yet."

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Source: Los Angeles Downtown News (http://www.downtownnews.com/articles/2008/04/28/news/news02.txt)

[NYC2ATX]

The tower and complex? Flawless. The park? Flawless. The city? Approaching flawless.

:D :D :D :D :D

[Quixote]

Here's an audio recording of the Civic Park presentation on April 22:

http://www.learcenter.org/html/projects/?cm=grand

[Quixote]

Grand Avenue Construction Pushed to 2009 (http://www.downtownnews.com/articles/2008/04/28/breaking_news/breaking.txt)

Developer Delays Phase One Completion Another Year

By Anna Scott

Developer Related Companies has announced that it is delaying construction on the $3 billion Grand Avenue project until next year, a company official said Monday afternoon. The company previously planned to break ground this summer.

Under the revised schedule, phase one construction would begin on Feb. 15, 2009, and finish in 2012 instead of 2011 as previously anticipated.

Initially, Related intended to begin construction on the project in October 2007, but the schedule has been pushed back multiple times.

The latest rescheduling stems from the difficulty in securing a construction loan in the ongoing credit crunch, said Related of California President Bill Witte. The previous schedule, he said, was based on the assumption that Related would be able to secure construction financing based on partially completed construction documents.

"As the financial world tightens and tightens, it's clear that's not going to be possible," said Witte.

"Nothing has changed in the timing of the documents," he added. "What has changed is our assessment of whether we can get a loan right now."

The developer plans to finalize construction documents for the Bunker Hill complex, which will include design details and help determine building costs, by the end of the year. Related will then move forward with demolishing a multi-level parking structure at Grand Avenue and First Street, probably in November, Witte said. Related previously intended to demolish the structure this past March, but decided to wait in lieu of the current fiscal situation. He said the parking structure, currently closed, could reopen in the interim.

"No one wants to have a big hiatus between the time we complete demolition and the time we start excavation," said Witte.

Plans for the approximately $1 billion first phase of the Frank Gehry-designed project, officially dubbed The Grand, call for a 48-story Mandarin Oriental Hotel & Residences with 295 rooms and 262 condominiums, a 19-story residential tower with 126 market-rate apartments and 98 affordable units, retail, a nightclub and a 16-acre Civic Park.

Construction on the park, Witte said, will proceed as scheduled, with groundbreaking slated for next spring and completion in 2011. The budget for its "base" design is $56 million, though additional amenities will cost more, officials have said.

Witte said that in June, Related will go before the Grand Avenue Authority, which is overseeing the project, to ask for formal approval of the construction delay.

[JDRCRASH]

It figures.

[M II A II R II K]

Yea that park could do with some tweaking

[JDRCRASH]

Yea that park could do with some tweaking

Seriously, though, I think its time we let this one die. Its already going to be over 2 years delayed.

[M II A II R II K]

Seriously, though, I think its time we let this one die. Its already going to be over 2 years delayed.

So is this officially on hold or cancelled or what....

[Quixote]

Seriously, though, I think its time we let this one die. Its already going to be over 2 years delayed.

That's the dumbest thing ever.

[JDRCRASH]

So is this officially on hold or cancelled or what....

I didn't say that. It's still a propasal; what i'm saying is that we need to give up on our hopes that this project will move forward before the real estate market upswings again.

IOW, you don't need to have it moved.....for now.:)

[JDRCRASH]

That's the dumbest thing ever.

Please, clarify what you mean by that before you make such a baseless remark.

Believe me, I like the project, too(it may be the most important project I wish would be completed); however ladowntowner is right, I just don't see it breaking ground soon anymore, whether this year or even next year.

Keep in mind the total cost is likely to rise further before it plummets; i'd predict by the time Related Co. obtains the construction loan, the total price of the undertaking will already have skyrocketed from $3 Billion, to $5 Billion.

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

That's the dumbest thing ever.


Oh Westsidelife, pleeeease, it's not the dumbest thing ever.......



In the article above the owner clarifies that:


The latest rescheduling stems from the difficulty in securing a construction loan in the ongoing credit crunch. The previous schedule, he said, was based on the assumption that Related would be able to secure construction financing based on partially completed construction documents.

"As the financial world tightens and tightens, it's clear that's not going to be possible," said Witte.

"Nothing has changed in the timing of the documents," he added. "What has changed is our assessment of whether we can get a loan right now."

The developer plans to finalize construction documents for the Bunker Hill complex, which will include design details and help determine building costs, by the end of the year.

They need to finalize the design details to secure a loan. It's still an ongoing project.

[BrandonJXN]

Owell..but thinking about it, 2009 will (hopefully) be the start of the US's turn around in the economic department.

[Quixote]

It would so not be a good laugh if Related were to cancel this project altogether, especially after all the hype and publicity it's gotten. So construction is being delayed for another year. It happens. Learn to be patient and get over it.

[JDRCRASH]

Oh Westsidelife, pleeeease, it's not the dumbest thing ever.......



It's not dumb, period. This project has been postponed since 2006, so yes, it will be over 2 years.

[Quixote]

^ That's not what you said earlier. You said that we should "let this one die" because of delay upon delay.

[JDRCRASH]

^ That's not what you said earlier. You said that we should "let this one die" because of delay upon delay.

When I meant die, I meant forgetting about it indefinitely until this period of economic contraction ceases, which won't be for a while.

IOW, we should assume that this project(for now) is dead because it may not make it in the current slowing building boom.

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

It's not dumb, period. This project has been postponed since 2006, so yes, it will be over 2 years.


Everybody forget it. JDR made another statement that everybody misread what he really meant and he will keep coming back with a new post until it's beaten to death.

OK, JDR, it's not dumb. Just really silly, period, if you're going to give up on every project that takes two years. If you look at all the serious proposals for LA, they're two years old, or getting really close to it. The Grand and maybe Park Fifth are the only ones that seem to be advertising what steps they're taking so that ground breaking can take place. So if you're going to give up on this one, then you might as well give up on all the LA projects. Then there is no need for you to visit the LA Foru.... hey.... no, I would miss your silly comments and contributions too much. Don't give up on us, and we won't give up on you!:hug:

[skellergroup]

I don't know what I think of this, but I do think it is good for LA.

[JDRCRASH]

OK, JDR, it's not dumb. Just really silly, period, if you're going to give up on every project that takes two years. If you look at all the serious proposals for LA, they're two years old, or getting really close to it. The Grand and maybe Park Fifth are the only ones that seem to be advertising what steps they're taking so that ground breaking can take place.

What about L.A. Live?

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

^What about it? It broke ground and is under construction. It's not a proposal and I said "proposals".

[JDRCRASH]

^What about it? It broke ground and is under construction. It's not a proposal and said "proposals".

Sighh....I was talking about the time when it was proposed to breaking ground!

Do you really believe i'm stupid enough to be oblivious that L.A. Live is U/C?

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

Sighh....I was talking about the time when it was proposed to breaking ground!



I just knew you were going to come back with something to explain "what you really meant"

Do you really believe i'm stupid enough to be oblivious that L.A. Live is U/C

Since you made it too easy for me, I'll leave this one alone.

[JDRCRASH]

I just knew you were going to come back with something to explain "what you really meant"

Okay then, everytime I want to explain myself, I will do it detail for detail, alright?

Be logical; I comment on L.A. Live being under-construction in the other threads, so how in the world could I not know that it was under-construction if i've credited it before on it's progress?:sly: (unless you forgot)


Since you made it too easy for me, I'll leave this one alone.

I'm taking that as a yes.

[Quixote]

LOL @ this "discussion".

[JDRCRASH]

LOL @ this "discussion".

Good point. Back on-topic:

I'm guessing the Parking structure is still closed. Was it a toll parking center? If so, that would bring extra revenues in the time being.

[BrandonJXN]

Hilarious.

[JDRCRASH]

Hilarious.

Exactly whats hilarious?

[colemonkee]

^ Your question asking if the parking garage was a "toll" garage. Yes, it is a paid garage. There is no free public parking in Downtown LA.

[Quixote]

CIVIC PARK MEETING HELD (http://www.grandavenuecommittee.com/updates.php)

May 2, 2008

A public outreach meeting was held on April 22, 2008 at 6:00 p.m. in the Grand Hall of the Dorothy Chandler Pavilion. The Civic Park, an approximately 16-acre site at the heart of downtown Los Angeles' civic and cultural center, will remake an existing public space into a spectacular community gathering place that provides an iconic centerpiece for Downtown Los Angeles. The Civic Park Master Plan strategy and design have been carefully cultivated by extensive outreach and dialogue with public stakeholders, elected officials and cultural partners. A place for all Angelenos, Civic Park will be a memorable destination for generations to come.

Designed by Rios Clementi Hale Studios at the direction of the Grand Avenue Authority, the Master Plan is conceived to offer the greatest public benefit in the shortest amount of time by using resources efficiently and providing for building in phases. Further, the initial base plan has been deliberately crafted to accommodate a potential enhanced plan with additional features when more funding is available.

The park's flexible design provides for the many facets of urban life, from passive to programmed, personal to public, picnics to parties. The Civic Park responds to its surrounding context, welcomes to diverse neighborhoods unique to L.A., and incorporates the latest technologies and sustainable techniques, while at the same time is sensitive to the site's rich history.

The park provides places for children and families, youth and school groups, couples and the elderly, downtown dwellers, daily commuters and cultural tourists from near and far. Its central location makes it easily accessible by local and regional mass transit and is convenient to existing cultural and civic places of interest in Downtown Los Angeles.

Park amenities will include improved pedestrian access, public restrooms, security lighting, electrical, data, event infrastructure, hardscape and landscape renovation, and multilingual directional signage.

Funding:

The $56 million Base Park budget is funded by the pre-paid ground rent paid by the Related Companies to the Grand Avenue Authority. The Enhanced Park will be implemented in phases as funding is secured by the Grand Avenue Authority from various sources including public funds, private donations and corporate sponsorships

Features and Design Strategy of the Base Park:

The existing 4-block site, bounded by Grand, Spring, Temple and First streets, is divided by three city streets and challenging topography - in some places 18 and 20 feet grade changes between blocks. To create a connected, unified and effortlessly navigated park, the Plan employs several key design strategies:

1. Tie it Together: Sun & Shade Gardens: A series of Sun Gardens connect the length of the northern boundary of the park, while the southern boundary is tied together with Shade Gardens, allowing diverse microclimates for all guests to enjoy.

2. Increase Pedestrian Access: Vehicular ramps will be removed from the pedestrian realm, creating a more generous, universally accessible entry points to the park, offering a softer, greener street edge that is welcoming to park goers and passers-by.

3. Soften Grade Changes: Using the site’s grade changes as an asset, the plan envisions generous amphitheater steps and planted terracing at Grand and at Broadway, providing integrated accessible pedestrian ramps and creating inhabitable vertical space that can serve as seating for events, dining al fresco or people watching.

4. Sustainable Leader: The plan calls for the park to serve as a demonstration site for sustainability. The park will employ sustainable strategies such as preserving existing specimen trees, relocating other healthy trees, establishing a native plant palette and botanical garden, and providing an educational outreach program.

Key features of the Base Park include:

1. Fountain Plaza: The popular, yet currently hidden, 60s-era Arthur J. Will Memorial Fountain will be renovated to become a focal point of Civic Park. Remaining sensitive to the iconic fountain’s historic significance, the fountain will be rehabilitated and reenergized to create an interactive gathering place.

2. Event Lawns & Market Place: Civic Park spaces are designed to provide an open framework allowing for diverse activities such as regular farmer’s markets and cultural festivals, gatherings for groups of 500 for small performances to larger assemblies of 20,000 or more for film and music festivals, yet also allowing for the quiet enjoyment of picnicking and reading.

3. Public Art: The Base Park identifies several prominent locations for future installation of iconic works of publicly-engaging outdoor sculpture. The plan’s ambitious public art program also contemplates artist workshop programming and outreach, curated seasonal installations and signature objet gardens.

http://www.grandavenuecommittee.com/images/BasePark_coloredPlan.jpg

Features of the Enhanced Park:

As additional funding is secured by the JPA, the park will be enhanced in a thoughtful, envisioned manner. Guided by the Master Plan, the enhancements may involve a competition for the design of additional architectural elements, such as the pavilion and bridge suggested in the master plan, and commissions for iconic works of art. Key features of the Enhanced Park include:

1. Event Pavilion: At the center of the park, a new open-air event pavilion will be a draw for visitors at all times of the day and serve as a host to civic parties, cultural festivals, and sponsored events.

2. Pedestrian Bridge: At Broadway, where the grade change is 20 feet, the Enhanced Plan calls for a pedestrian bridge spanning the street to unify the pedestrian experience of the park, provide a lookout viewing platform, and create a gateway marker over the street.

3. Beautified Streetscape: Integrating the park with the streets that cut through it, the Enhanced Park Plan proposes distinctive street pavings to define a broader pedestrian realm and calm traffic.

4. Public Art: The Enhanced Park Plan will realize the interactive outdoor sculptural pieces planned for in the Base Park. It will also build upon the series of cultural objet gardens of the Base Park.

http://www.grandavenuecommittee.com/images/EnhancedPark_coloredPlan.jpg

[Echo Park]

3. Beautified Streetscape: Integrating the park with the streets that cut through it, the Enhanced Park Plan proposes distinctive street pavings to define a broader pedestrian realm and calm traffic.



I don't see how this is gonna happen or work. its going to be a problem as long as those streets are allowed to cut through the "park." I don't think traffic is such a concern at this point. I would rather have those streets eliminated and have continuous green space from grand to broadway

[JDRCRASH]

^ Your question asking if the parking garage was a "toll" garage. Yes, it is a paid garage. There is no free public parking in Downtown LA.

Well not everyone knows that.

[BrandonJXN]

^ Rarely do you find free parking in ANY downtown.

[JDRCRASH]

^ Rarely do you find free parking in ANY downtown.

What makes you say that?

[Quixote]

^ What's so hard to understand about that? Why provide free parking when you can charge people money for it?

[JDRCRASH]

^ What's so hard to understand about that? Why provide free parking when you can charge people money for it?

Oh, sure, charge people for parking anywhere. :rolleyes:

I hope you were referring exclusively about downtown, and not the valley.

[BrandonJXN]

What does the valley have to do with anything?

Fuck it. Never mind. This is retarded.

[Quixote]

^ LOL, I'm here for ya. :tup:

[colemonkee]

Guys, if a forumer bothers you, just ignore them. There's no need to call anyone 'retarded'. Let's keep it civil.

(ThreeHundred, this is not directed at you)

[Echo Park]

Even that is difficult when "This message is hidden because JDRCRASH is on your ignore list. " appears 10 times on every page.

[JDRCRASH]

Even that is difficult when "This message is hidden because JDRCRASH is on your ignore list. " appears 10 times on every page.

Umm, what do you mean by that?

[Quixote]

^ JDRCRASH, you do realize that you're baiting people...?

[JDRCRASH]

^ JDRCRASH, you do realize that you're baiting people...?

Alright, i'll stop.

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

^ JDRCRASH, you do realize that you're baiting people...?



Two things are very obvious. 1). He's baiting 2). He's trying to see how high he can get his post number. These are just two reasons why the threads he's involved with get off track.


Echoing Echo's statement, they need a better plan in regards to the streets that cross the park. And I agree, Hill and Broadway need to end at the park perimeter and green space should cover the area.

I think one misconception, which was pointed out in an above post, is that the area is larger than it actually is. If you visit the area now, it's currently laid out as a park (although not a nice park), with benches and trees and streets that cross it. And it doesn't feel very big. Yes, the parking lot in front of city hall will go away, but except for that, the only way to enlarge the park area is to cover or delete the streets that cross through it.

(I know the county buildings should also go, but that is a huge budget item)

[LosAngelesSportsFan]

isnt this building going to be taller than 500 feet? at 48 stories, including a hotel portion, i would imagine it would be at least 500 feet. It should be in the skyscraper forum.

[DowntownCharlieBrown]

^

Posted by erickg47

Park fifth is 249.9 m
Grand ave project is 190.0 m.
Cal plaza is 176.2 m
Cal plaza 2 is 228.6 m
Gas Tower 228.3

I hope this helps.


This was posted in another thread. 190m equals 623ft. So, if this number is correct, then the thread should be moved.

erickg47 - what was your source?

[JDRCRASH]

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