Phoenix CityScape Thread [Archive] - Page 39

nickkoto

Aug 15, 2009, 7:28 PM

bwonger06

Aug 15, 2009, 9:32 PM

^

Whether it's "affordable" or not, I'd just like to see some of the downtown housing being rental units. They'll more quickly become affordable if nobody moves in. Overpriced condos tend to stay empty because the builders can only lower the price so much before they assure themselves of a loss, but lease pricing is much more flexible. Once the building is in place, the landlord mentality is more one of "How much rent can I collect this month?" rather than holding out with an empty unit for 18 months, hoping for that whale to walk inside the sales office.

The Summit converted a majority of their units into Apartment units, and the company is still teetering on the point of bankruptcy. Anyone know the vacancy rates at Alta Phoenix?

And lets be realistic, it is downtown, it is going to be expensive to live in a nice place just because the cost of build. I cannot honestly see Red building units unless can know they will be able to get 1000 dollars for your basic one bedroom and this may not qualify as affordable to many but realistically, it is when comparing to other urban cities.

HooverDam

Aug 15, 2009, 10:47 PM

kaneui

Aug 15, 2009, 11:15 PM

So what ground levels are taken so far? Golds, CVS, AJs, The Fox Chop House...? I would think, is the SE corner of PSP taken? I think that is open, so I am betting on Lucky Strike going there.

I can't imagine someone putting a bowling ally anywhere but ground level. Sorry Hoover. :)

^There's a Lucky Strike on the second floor of L.A. LIVE:

http://www.lalive.com/content.php?section=about&page=siteplan-3

Vicelord John

Aug 15, 2009, 11:20 PM

L.A. LIVE:

ooooooh. I want that.

gymratmanaz

Aug 15, 2009, 11:53 PM

I stand corrected Hoover. :)

HooverDam

Aug 16, 2009, 9:14 AM

Im not really into bowling, but bowling either on a 2nd floor or underground (like in that former alley across from the Westward Ho) seems very appealing to me. I have no idea why. Maybe I like the idea of using steps before I bowl? Its complete silliness but it makes bowling seem twice as appealing as it otherwise would have for me.

Leo the Dog

Aug 16, 2009, 12:08 PM

DT Phx definitely does need new urban affordable housing, but I don't think CS is the place to start. This is the city's premier address, ground zero, if you will. The city should have numerous housing options within walking distance of CS, but I wouldn't want CS to have low-rent tenants in a $900 million development.

glynnjamin

Aug 17, 2009, 4:27 AM

Low rent vs No rent? I think I'll take the working class poor over another mostly vacant 44 Monroe.

bwonger06

Aug 17, 2009, 6:41 AM

^Actually I think most other urban downtowns are cheaper to live in then ours since theres a greater stock of housing options. I remember Don posting numbers like a year ago or something from Chicago, SD and other places and they were notably cheaper than Downtown Phoenix.

I think I remember a post about cost and those were looking at ridiculous condo prices and not apartment rent, and the circumstances behind condo pricing can be questionable (for example there is a 2 bdrm safari drive condo going for 215,000, it will not ever sale) .

I have close friends living in Chicago and they say a respectable place has 1500 going rates for a one bedroom. I really do not know the rent in SD but based of the two or three listings I looked up in the gas lamp, they also run in the 1500 for a 700 square place. Compare that to Alta which you can get for a "bargain" price of 900.

admdavid

Aug 17, 2009, 4:25 PM

Rents in SD are ridiculous! Not NYC ridiculous, but when I moved from PHX my eyes were opened. Studios for $900/month up to $3200/month for a 2 bedroom condo. That's rent! PHX rents are much more reasonable, IMHO.

PHXguyinOKC

Aug 17, 2009, 5:13 PM

i wish Phoenix would get an apartment tower. here in OKC, downtown apartments are somewhat hard to get. the prices aren't outrageous, decent amenities, and it seems a lot people here want to have an urban lifestyle.
http://www.regency-tower.com/
this place is right across from the OKC Bombing Memorial and has 900 sq ft, 2 bedroom apartments priced at $1000/mo.

NorthScottsdale

Aug 17, 2009, 6:26 PM

I think I remember a post about cost and those were looking at ridiculous condo prices and not apartment rent, and the circumstances behind condo pricing can be questionable (for example there is a 2 bdrm safari drive condo going for 215,000, it will not ever sale) .

I have close friends living in Chicago and they say a respectable place has 1500 going rates for a one bedroom. I really do not know the rent in SD but based of the two or three listings I looked up in the gas lamp, they also run in the 1500 for a 700 square place. Compare that to Alta which you can get for a "bargain" price of 900.

You don't think a condo at Safari Drive would sell for $215,000?? That seems like a really good price. Right in Downtown Scottsdale and those Condos look really nice.

Sonoran_Dweller

Aug 17, 2009, 10:07 PM

Even with all the mayhem downtown today, tower #1 looks as good as ever:

http://www.azcentral.com/commphotos/azcentral/11782/10/25

I think it is a good angle.

bwonger06

Aug 18, 2009, 6:30 PM

You don't think a condo at Safari Drive would sell for $215,000?? That seems like a really good price. Right in Downtown Scottsdale and those Condos look really nice.

I forgot to mention that it was a shortsale that doesnt even come close to its comps. No agent out there is going touch that property with a 100 ft pole because the bank won't accept 215,000 for the property.

phoenixboi08

Aug 18, 2009, 8:13 PM

HX_Guy

Aug 19, 2009, 7:17 AM

They've done quite a bit of work in the last couple of weeks...

The concrete forms for the south tower elevator core has actually jumped on level, which was expected, but now comes the real test of what happens from here on. I'm told vertical construction of the south tower is ~12 months out and they will probably stop with the core here for the time being, though Im very curious if we'll see attachment "nubs" sticking out of the core for future rebar.

The parking garage is at street level all along Central Ave and the rest has just the top "ceiling" left to go, probably should all be done within the next few weeks I would guess.

http://nitnelav.com/DTAugust182009/4.jpg

http://nitnelav.com/DTAugust182009/5.jpg

http://nitnelav.com/DTAugust182009/6.jpg

http://nitnelav.com/DTAugust182009/7.jpg

Panoramic shots? Yes, the App store has that too. :D

http://nitnelav.com/DTAugust182009/8.jpg

HX_Guy

Aug 19, 2009, 5:50 PM

Word is that steel for Patriot's Block will arrive in September at which point the vertical construction will begin.

gymratmanaz

Aug 19, 2009, 6:08 PM

Great News!!!!!

CANUC

Aug 19, 2009, 6:46 PM

Word is that steel for Patriot's Block will arrive in September at which point the vertical construction will begin.

Thanks for the update. This actually got me thinking though. Has anyone actually seen any image of what the redisgned park is suppose to look like? I mean they removed the apartments so what is shown isn't what will be built. RED never released any updated images. I'm assuming it is going to be simply 2 floors a'la AZ Center.

Luke Skyscraper

Aug 19, 2009, 9:07 PM

It will be such a waste- probally the most valuable and strategically located land in DT Phoenix. And they will most likely put up 2 story buildings as CANUC speculated. They should maximize the usage of the parcel. Crying shame!

HX_Guy

Aug 19, 2009, 11:03 PM

Holy shit!!! :D

South tower elevator core 2nd floor rebar!

http://nitnelav.com/DTAugust192009/2.jpg

http://nitnelav.com/DTAugust192009/3.jpg

Leo the Dog

Aug 19, 2009, 11:37 PM

This is good news. It means they actually do intend to build the 2nd tower (soon) and not cap it off like Colliers!

Can't wait for the PSP block to start construction. It'll be nice to have some structures on that huge vacant swath of DT land.

gymratmanaz

Aug 20, 2009, 1:18 AM

HX....Can I now say "I told you so!!!!!!?????"

Luke Skyscraper

Aug 20, 2009, 1:19 AM

HX,
When do you snap your photos? I rarely see construction workers in the photos. Early morn or late afternoon?

combusean

Aug 20, 2009, 1:52 AM

They're working on the 2nd floor of the retail podium as well. I wouldn't think much of this.

gymratmanaz

Aug 20, 2009, 2:00 AM

Maybe they are building up to the retail levels so they can have the shops in, then they can later continue with the hotel and tower? So maybe we will see two or three stories and the courtyard...then when they decide more tower specifics, they can continue on the tower?????????

Vicelord John

Aug 20, 2009, 2:23 AM

Very good thought. Immediate leases = better than maybe leases.

gymratmanaz

Aug 20, 2009, 2:37 AM

Thanks. I get 'em every once in a while.

HX_Guy

Aug 20, 2009, 2:44 AM

I dont think they would build retail on the first floors of the hotel tower without building the rest. Think about all the construction...the huge tower crane right next to you...it would be too unfinished to be usable I think.

gymratmanaz

Aug 20, 2009, 2:48 AM

But they could build the frame and exteriors, then when the tower is being built or almost done, the shops can be completed inside, ready to open once the tower crane is dismantled.

renone

Aug 20, 2009, 4:31 PM

As already mentioned, for the first time in over a month there are workers all over the south core today. New rebar in addition to that earlier picture is now going up. Not sure what it means, but it definitely looks like the south core will be jumping a level soon.

In other news, it appears they will be pouring the concrete on what used to be Central tomorrow or early next week. They are laying the rebar on that section today.

HX_Guy

Aug 20, 2009, 4:41 PM

Looks like Combusean was right about the elevator core being related to the retail podium.

They are going to build the elevator core to level 3 so they can put the retail podium in place. The core will stop there until the hotel portion is ready to be built, which I'm now told could be as soon as December 2009 or as late as August 2010.

HX_Guy

Aug 20, 2009, 6:41 PM

You can see the south core from this webcam:

http://wwc.instacam.com/instacamimg3/phnxa/08202009/082020091129_l.jpg

It's going to be a nice vantage point to watch the tower rise.

gymratmanaz

Aug 20, 2009, 10:56 PM

I said it too!!!!!!!!

Looks like Combusean was right about the elevator core being related to the retail podium.

They are going to build the elevator core to level 3 so they can put the retail podium in place. The core will stop there until the hotel portion is ready to be built, which I'm now told could be as soon as December 2009 or as late as August 2010.

plinko

Aug 20, 2009, 11:07 PM

So the work being done is covered under that structural modification permit that HX posted a couple months ago?

It looks like the credit markets are freeing up a bit with regard to real estate (the notable BofA deal in NYC), but I still have a hard time seeing how they are going to make this work right now.

You guys may be looking at that stump for a good couple of years. Let's hope not.

AZ KID

Aug 20, 2009, 11:10 PM

So if they do end up not building the south tower until next August or even later, will they cap it off or just keep it as is?

HX_Guy

Aug 20, 2009, 11:27 PM

I assume they will throw a tarp on it or something until they are ready to continue building it. That is, if they will continue in the short term (12 months or less). If it's longer then that, they would probably build some semi-permanent roof on the core like at Colliers.

Plinko: Your guess is as good as mine on the permits. I have no idea how they are building this core as high as they are without any permits for it. I can't imagine that this would still fall under the parking garage portion of the permits. One possibility is that maybe a separate project number as been started that we don't know about? Everything so far has been under Cityscape 06-5309...but is it possible there is another out there for the south tower/south podium?

plinko

Aug 20, 2009, 11:44 PM

^So you haven't seen any permits for the retail podium either? That would be interesting...maybe they are still under review.

You know what, remember what they re-platted the site and broke it into two? Maybe it has a different set of tracking numbers?

Just a thought...

HX_Guy

Aug 21, 2009, 12:00 AM

Yea I thought about that too, because they did split up the block into two separate plots.

But yea, that's correct, there are no permits associated with a retail podium for Block 22.

combusean

Aug 21, 2009, 12:53 AM

^ i thought this would get built under the MESA permit?

HX_Guy

Aug 21, 2009, 1:07 AM

From my understanding the MESA permit was for the space between the two towers/podiums, basically the stairs, walking area, shade structures and landscaping.

Edit: Here is what the guy assigned to the MESA permit said...

"The mesa is a private courtyard that exists between the two towers. It will include hardscape, landscape planters, fountains, stairs, ramps, and access to either building on the site. "

bwonger06

Aug 21, 2009, 7:19 AM

It looks like the credit markets are freeing up a bit with regard to real estate (the notable BofA deal in NYC), but I still have a hard time seeing how they are going to make this work right now.

I am just wondering what deal this is? Anyone have any information on it? (I searched and couldnt find anything)

Sonoran_Dweller

Aug 21, 2009, 7:44 AM

Could it be this tower, which is finishing construction...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bank_of_America_Tower,_New_York_City

kingofleos

Aug 22, 2009, 4:35 AM

Geesh.

Imagine that thing in downtown Phoenix. Then we'd be getting somewhere.

AZ KID

Aug 22, 2009, 4:37 AM

photo from CoCo Fire on flicker...

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3580/3835999190_9bf416b192.jpg

CANUC

Aug 22, 2009, 7:02 AM

I was downtown today and noticed that they had extended the rebar a bit higher on the southwest corner of tower 1. You can make it out in the picture posted above by AZ Kid. In person it actually looks like it went up quite a bit. I believe this is the "shorter" end of the sloped paraphet so this building may still get another two stories of height and they may indeed completely cover that ugly mechanical penthouse...are you listening Sheraton?

Edit: On a side note, if your looking for something different I strongly recommend Inglorious Basterds; funny, violent, good acting...must see.

glynnjamin

Aug 23, 2009, 5:06 AM

^But long...too long. And typical Tarentino - bunch of people sitting around a table talking for an hour before anything can happen/

bwonger06

Aug 23, 2009, 6:38 AM

^But long...too long. And typical Tarentino - bunch of people sitting around a table talking for an hour before anything can happen/

I think thats what his films excellent. I love the dialogues in basterds, especially the first chapter and the bar scene (heck all of the dialogues where great). His characters always have a lot of depth to them, especially the "Jew Hunter". Way better than the all-action terminator 4, transformers 2, gi joe movies of the summer (although District 9 was a very good action flick).

gymratmanaz

Aug 23, 2009, 4:46 PM

The elevator core isn't the only rebar sticking up above ground level. Look at some of the other columns. They are not at the height of the elevator core, but they are above ground level.

HX_Guy

Aug 23, 2009, 7:41 PM

From yesterday...

http://nitnelav.com/DTAug222009/1.jpg

http://nitnelav.com/DTAug222009/2.jpg

http://nitnelav.com/DTAug222009/3.jpg

Leo the Dog

Aug 24, 2009, 3:10 PM

Phase I is really going to give Wash/Central a real nice hemmed in corner. Almost like a downtown should be.

kingofleos

Aug 24, 2009, 7:46 PM

I was sitting in traffic last night heading east on Jefferson (headed to Depeche Mode concert) and saw someone snapping photos out of their car towards the construction.

Wonder if it was anybody from here?

Vicelord John

Aug 24, 2009, 8:04 PM

because only people on this site (12) in Phoenix (5,000,000) take pictures of buildings under construction.

kingofleos

Aug 24, 2009, 9:29 PM

Hence the word 'wonder'.

Ass.

Vicelord John

Aug 24, 2009, 9:40 PM

JI5

Aug 25, 2009, 3:17 AM

funny part is... it probably was someone from this site.

NIXPHX77

Aug 25, 2009, 7:53 AM

I was sitting in traffic last night heading east on Jefferson (headed to Depeche Mode concert) and saw someone snapping photos out of their car towards the construction.
How were DM? saw them for "Violator" tour in the day.
how were Peter Bjorn & John (or whatever)?

kingofleos

Aug 25, 2009, 5:57 PM

How were DM? saw them for "Violator" tour in the day.
how were Peter Bjorn & John (or whatever)?

DM kicked ass, hell of a concert.

Peter Bjorn & John were extremely entertaining, and they had a song I've heard on the radio or movie/show somewhere. Just don't know the name.

Back to CityScape. It looked great at night, my friend with me was shocked at the site of the building. Last time she was there was before it was even built. Kinda cool to see someone's reaction who hadn't seen any progress at the site.

ljbuild

Aug 25, 2009, 6:41 PM

A BRIEF UPDATE ABOUT THE SOUTH TOWER OF CITYSCAPE.

The following paragraph (ABOUT CITYSCAPE) was taken out of the July issue

of Southwest contractor magazine which specializes in CURRENT & up to

date status on various projects.

However, the statements that I cut out below focused on the SOUTH

TOWER or hotel palomar. Here it goes:
-------------------------------------------------------------

" Earnest points out that the current economy also provided some cost breaks on materials. Conversely, though, more rental concessions have to be made, including increased tenant improvement allowances, he says.

Still, Earnest says the space is 60% committed. Tenants include Gold’s Gym, Fox Restaurant Concepts, a CVS Pharmacy, Urban Outfitters, Jennings Strouss & Salmon and Squire Sanders & Dempsey law firms. Wachovia was set to be a major tenant, but its buyer, Wells Fargo, will sublease the intended space.

Leif says building information modeling has been used throughout the project, and that has saved “time in the field and the shop, and it saves money.”

“I truly believe this is where the industry is absolutely headed,” Leif says. “Contractors are getting more savvy with computer work. So are subcontractors.”

Next comes CityScape’s Palomar Hotel. Earnest says RED is working through the financing now, and he expects construction to start by the end of the year. The 250-room hotel will be south of the tower. "
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Basically I think that they are waiting for all the activity to clear from the Wachovia tower project so that they have more room to work with for the south tower project.

bwonger06

Aug 26, 2009, 6:28 AM

DM kicked ass, hell of a concert.

Peter Bjorn & John were extremely entertaining, and they had a song I've heard on the radio or movie/show somewhere. Just don't know the name.

Probably young folks

Next comes CityScape’s Palomar Hotel. Earnest says RED is working through the financing now, and he expects construction to start by the end of the year. The 250-room hotel will be south of the tower. "
--------------------------------------------------------------------
Basically I think that they are waiting for all the activity to clear from the Wachovia tower project so that they have more room to work with for the south tower project.

They are actually waiting for Financing as stated. I talked to an exec at Downtown Phoenix Inc. yesterday and he said Red is trying all they can to get a lender to finance the second tower and they hope they can secure something by the end of year. From what it sounds like, Red really wants to build this thing, but lenders are reluctant.

combusean

Aug 26, 2009, 6:59 AM

...

... yes, we've seen that article and that schedule is a fantasy PR stunt that contradicts more recent information from HX that far more realistically puts it at much longer than that, backed up by the complete lack of evidence in their permitting and, considering they don't even know what they want yet construction is at best a year away. The fact that they don't even have financing to build the fucking thing suggests we should already toss it into the dustbin of historical projects that died a similar fate.

please stop posting some random thing you found like it's new. you do that all the time, and it's annoying.

ljbuild

Aug 26, 2009, 4:34 PM

... yes, we've seen that article and that schedule is a fantasy PR stunt that contradicts more recent information from HX that far more realistically puts it at much longer than that, backed up by the complete lack of evidence in their permitting and, considering they don't even know what they want yet construction is at best a year away. The fact that they don't even have financing to build the fucking thing suggests we should already toss it into the dustbin of historical projects that died a similar fate.

please stop posting some random thing you found like it's new. you do that all the time, and it's annoying.

Waah Waah waah :wah: :wah: :baby: :baby:

PHX31

Aug 26, 2009, 4:42 PM

combusean

Aug 26, 2009, 5:14 PM

Waah Waah waah :wah: :wah: :baby: :baby:

when somebody's name is bold on this website, it's best to take heed of their advice.

you people are at each other's throats in every thread. settle the hell down =P

Vicelord John

Aug 26, 2009, 5:34 PM

Yeah listen to sean or he will e-rest your ass.

AZ KID

Aug 29, 2009, 10:05 PM

Permit# RVSN-0803991-01 Issue Date 8/28/09 Expires 8/28/10
Permit Description CITY SCAPE - BLOCK 77
Project 06-5309 CITYSCAPE

Description/Scope of Work: COMMERCIAL SHELL

DESCRIPTION OF WORK: TWO RETAIL BUILDINGS, SUB SURFACE GARAGE, IMPROVEMENTS, SITE IMPROVEMENTS AND PEDESTRIAN BRIDGE ASSOCIATED WITH CITYSCAPE BLOCK 77.

and a picture from jackdog2508...

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3573/3860829639_339fccbc85.jpg

Leo the Dog

Aug 30, 2009, 1:55 AM

^^^ Anyone know what's above Hanny's? That would be a great spot for a club or something with roof access.

gymratmanaz

Aug 30, 2009, 2:10 AM

Yes, it's called Hanny's. It is their roof top bar. They are planning on using it as the place gets busier.

Vicelord John

Aug 30, 2009, 2:21 AM

Yes, it's called Hanny's. It is their roof top bar. They are planning on using it as the place gets busier.

I didn't think he was asking if that is the name of it.....

and no, Hanny's does not have the lease on the rooftop bar and it is part of another space within the building.

pbenjamin

Aug 30, 2009, 3:35 PM

There is a sign in the window on an upper floor that indicates that it for rent. I think it refers to office space.

geeski

Aug 31, 2009, 3:51 PM

http://azarchitecture.com/property_detail.cfm?auto_id=651

Leo the Dog

Aug 31, 2009, 4:01 PM

Hanny's building is available for office or "other uses". It doesn't really get anymore urban than this location. And think, if Phoenix ever did create a pedestrian mall on 1st st, what a great location for some bars, one on the roof, one in the basement (pool hall?).

glynnjamin

Aug 31, 2009, 5:25 PM

That's funny, when I first went to Hanny's they let me take my drink up to the roof and hang out. I stopped going after the service became deplorable and the patrons started to look like people out of a Bret Easton Ellis novel.

gymratmanaz

Aug 31, 2009, 5:51 PM

True, and when I went there, the staff told us that they owned the roof and were putting a rooftop bar up there in time.

Vicelord John

Aug 31, 2009, 5:55 PM

True, and when I went there, the staff told us that they owned the roof and were putting a rooftop bar up there in time.

exactly the opposite of what I was told. I asked them when the rooftop bar was opening and the bartender told me never because the rooftop area was part of an adjoining space. He told me they plan to open in the basement, however.

HX_Guy

Sep 1, 2009, 5:47 AM

Well shit, how about this...a permit actually associated with the south tower, though it's only for level 1 - 3, but at least that means there won't be a pad like at Colliers, right?

Permit# PHAS-0705627-05 Issue Date Expires 8/31/10
Permit Description BLK 22 SOUTH TOWER
Project 06-5309 CITYSCAPE

DESCRIPTION OF WORK: STRUCTURAL ONLY PLANS FOR THE CONCRETE SHEARWALLS AT LEVELS 1 THRU 3 OF THE SOUTH TOWER

Evil Empire

Sep 1, 2009, 7:04 AM

Like you said, better than a pad...

NorthScottsdale

Sep 2, 2009, 8:15 PM

Lucky Strike Lanes coming to Phoenix
(Credit: Courtesy of Lucky Strike Lanes.)
The swanky bowling destination Lucky Strike Lanes & Lounge is moving into downtown Phoenix's CityScape development, announced RED Development LLC, the company behind the project.

Known for its signature cocktails and celebrity guests, the alley is set to open in the spring of 2010, which is when many of the restaurants, bars and shops in the $900 million space are scheduled to open. Eventually, a grocery store, hotel, offices and a pharmacy will open in the mixed-used development, stretching from First Avenue to Second Street and from Washington to Jefferson streets.

The Phoenix location will be 18,000 square feet, with 12 lanes, four of which will be in the Luxe Lanes bar, and it will have a VIP area.

In more than 20 cities, the 5-year-old chain has brought an element of red-carpet panache to a traditionally blue-collar pastime, as celebs in New York City, Chicago, Los Angeles and Miami have flocked to the Lucky Strikes in those cities.

In New York City, Gossip Girl's Ed Westwick hosted his 22nd birthday party there recently, complete with a signature cucumber martini written up in InStyle. That location was also where Rihanna canoodled with Aubrey “Drake” Graham while drinking whiskey and apple juice in May. And in LA, it's where John Mayer Twittered about bowling poorly with Jennifer Anniston this winter. Lucky Strike has also been filmed in episodes of the new "90210" and "America's Next Top Model."

The lanes have lounges with low, cushy seating in some cities, wine bars in others, and they all serve food fit for the velvet-rope crowd, including such small plates as tuna-steak lollipops and fried mac and cheese bites, as well as a turkey brie sandwiches and salads.

But possibly the most unexpected thing about the new downtown bowling alley is that it will have a dress code. Among the clothing banned will be athletic wear, including sweats, or jerseys, excessively baggy clothing, construction boots and headgear.

HX_Guy

Sep 2, 2009, 8:24 PM

Fucking awesome!

Jsmscaleros

Sep 2, 2009, 8:30 PM

Hmm, I love bowling but this sounds like my personal hell.

More douche bags from Scottsdale will come to downtown.

Oh well, it's all part of the vibrancy of the urban fabric... I'll be a few blocks away at Rose and Crown or Lost Leaf.

HX_Guy

Sep 2, 2009, 8:53 PM

Shit a regular bowling alley sounds like my personal hell...this one sounds awesome. Sounds like there won't be a crapload of kids running around.

Tempe_Duck

Sep 2, 2009, 9:03 PM

HX_Guy

Sep 2, 2009, 9:06 PM

No jerseys or sports clothing. That is retarded. That eliminates thousands of people from going there before and after Suns or Dbacks games.

Why would you eliminate that many potential customers right off the bat?

You eliminate some yet attract others. I wouldn't want to go hang out with a bunch of people in sports jerseys on a night like this. Not that there is anything wrong with that...I am part of that crowd too...but Lucky Strike sounds like a mix of bowling and club/lounge and if I'm getting dressed up to go clubbing, I don't want to mix with jersey wearing sports fans.

Tempe_Duck

Sep 2, 2009, 9:18 PM

You eliminate some yet attract others. I wouldn't want to go hang out with a bunch of people in sports jerseys on a night like this. Not that there is anything wrong with that...I am part of that crowd too...but Lucky Strike sounds like a mix of bowling and club/lounge and if I'm getting dressed up to go clubbing, I don't want to mix with jersey wearing sports fans.

Why? Why does it matter if people are wearing jerseys? It not like just because someone is wearing a Nash jersey doesn't mean the smell or something?

HX_Guy

Sep 2, 2009, 9:28 PM

Haha what does it have to fo with smelly people?

It matters because it change the vibe of the place. If I'm out clubbing and dressed up, I want to be around other people dressed up and looking good.

Tempe_Duck

Sep 2, 2009, 9:43 PM

Haha what does it have to fo with smelly people?

It matters because it change the vibe of the place. If I'm out clubbing and dressed up, I want to be around other people dressed up and looking good.

Ok, ok. I guess I just hard to imagine an upscale bowling alley. I see where you are coming from.

EDIT: Sweet...this is my 100th post. Still way below others, like you HX, but cool for me.

gymratmanaz

Sep 2, 2009, 10:14 PM

I couldn't agree more. How many complaints are there that there aren't enough cool clubs downtown? All of them are in Scottsdale. WELL, here you go. How awesome to have a really cool and unique club that attracts a different client base than TGI Fridays....not knocking Fridays. I used to manage them. I have been to the one in Vegas. It is a great destination business. It will draw people downtown that don't do sports stuff. Diversity and variety are what make a downtown!!!!!!!

Luke Skyscraper

Sep 2, 2009, 10:43 PM

It is so laughable that the still refer to Cityscape as a "$900 million mixed use development". At least half of the project has been cancelled. It should be refered to as the "significantly less than $900 million project"!

renone

Sep 2, 2009, 11:00 PM

Anyone else suprised that they are still saying everything will open in Spring 2010? I'm looking at PSP through my window right now. If that moonscape is finished in 6 months I will be duly impressed. They haven't made any attempt to go vertical.

Leo the Dog

Sep 3, 2009, 3:58 PM

I'll definitely go bowling here when it opens! This could make for a fun night in DT Phx.

Has anyone had the thought that instead of building a large upscale AJ's (with financial troubles) in Cityscape that they should replace that with a more modest Fresh n Easy? I don't think the DT population is there yet to support a larger grocery store especially with the CS condos on hold.

HX_Guy

Sep 3, 2009, 4:03 PM

Leo the Dog

Sep 3, 2009, 4:09 PM

Why do you think Fresh and Easy is doing better then AJs?

Fresh and Easy has "built" many stores around the Valley that are ready to go, just need to be stocked, that have been sitting for months, and word is that a lot of them will not even open anymore.

Oh really? I didn't know that.

I was just thinking that a mid-sized store may be a better fit to serve the immediate DT population. The prices are much lower than an AJ's too. Don't get me wrong, I'm definitely glad DT is finally getting a grocery store after...what...3 decades?

CANUC

Sep 3, 2009, 4:52 PM

I actually agree with Leo on this one. Fresh and Easy seems to be a better fit in downtown than an AJ's. It has nothing to do with how successful the chain is, and the fact that they overbuilt in a down economy is their own doing, but the chain serves a real purpose. There is one by my house and when I don't feel like dealing with one of the larger chain stores or I just need one quick item I alwasy go to Fresh and Easy over the larger stores. It's just convinient and isn't that sort of what a grocery store downtown needs to be? Think about without the head count the store will probably cater to downtown employees most of which aren't looking to do a weeks worth of grocery shopping but instead grab a couple of items before they head home. Plus the price point seems to fit better, AJ's is nice but the niche it fills is smaller. That's why there aren't as many AJ's.

HX_Guy

Sep 3, 2009, 4:55 PM

Think about without the head count the store will probably cater to downtown employees most of which aren't looking to do a weeks worth of grocery shopping but instead grab a couple of items before they head home.

Sounds like you're describing AJs to me. It's not a full grocery store like Fry's or Safeway, but has your essentials and then some...plus a full service lunch bar and deli and bakery, which will be great for downtown lunch.

glynnjamin

Sep 3, 2009, 5:18 PM

^Except AJs is about twice as expensive. We've suggested multiple times that F&E would be better in CityScape than AJs. And while F&E has overbuilt in the 'burbs they are not nearly in the same dire financial straits that Basha's is. The space just seems to suit F&E better for multiple reason. I can do a week's worth of grocery shopping in about 5 minutes at Indian School/7th Ave F&E where as I wait in line for twice that at any Frys or Safeway in town. That's the kind of place we want in downtown.

Leo the Dog

Sep 3, 2009, 5:55 PM

While I'm thinking about it, there should be a liquor store somewhere in the heart of DT. I wonder if the AJ's will have a full liquor section like the rest of their locations do.

JKPhx

Sep 3, 2009, 7:51 PM

AJ's will be a much better fit then fresh n easy at Cityscape. Look at the AJ's on central and camelback, always filled with workers from M&I bank and others from surrounding businesses. As a graduate of Brophy I cant tell you how many times I ate there after school or ran inside to grab something before school. I imagine the same will happen for those who work in the downtown core.

Also, AJ's will fit the atmosphere Cityscape planners are trying to evoke much better then a fresh n easy. AJ's will simply look better and represent cityscape better to those who visit.